WOW.... there has been atleast one casualty in this thread....some poor soul has actually been encouraged to endure the 26 episode hell of Rahxephon. Shame on you EvaXephon...FOR SHAME.

Anyway as I was reading this thread I realized something about EVA, well i didnt realize it..but realized it being pertinent to this conversation.

Eva included a lot, if not all, of the standard surface level cliches in a mecha show that have long since been taken for granted, but did something interesting, it incorporated them in a twisted and intresting way. Their existance was explained and important to the plot. The cliches werent just put there for no reason. RahXephon did something similar... however that hardly makes it a ripoff since the plot was completely different.

To help you out i went to the trouble of looking some words up on dictionary.com

1)clone - A cell, group of cells, or organism that are descended from and genetically identical to a single common ancestor, such as a bacterial colony whose members arose from a single original cell.

**Rah cant be a clone of Eva since in fact niether are derived from an organic source.

2)Identical - Having such a close similarity or resemblance as to be essentially equal or interchangeable.

**If i bought the EVA box set, put in the DVD and RahXephon started playing..I would shot the next person I saw. SO no, they arent interchangable.

Originally posted on: 07.21.2006, 11:06 PM

MagicianCamille wrote:Ya dude. =0!!!


The similarities between Rahxephon and Evangelion are superficial. This arguement has been done to death, and it gets stupider every time.

No anime is 100% original, take some time to digest that, and then move on with your life.

Berserk is Bitches!!!

Originally posted on: 07.21.2006, 11:25 PM

omg ur rite

I found this link on these boards a while back. Good thing I bookmarked it.

Originally posted on: 07.21.2006, 11:26 PM

And the Wiki also says the Rah was influenced by 5 other Animes such as Gundam SEED. Saysing the Rah is a copy of Evangelin is a shot in the dark at best.

Originally posted on: 07.21.2006, 11:50 PM

soulreaper wrote:Looks like you're not the only one who can take random scenes and paste them together into an unholy mixture of RahVangelion-ness

I found this link on these boards a while back. Good thing I bookmarked it.

That was actually pretty cool.

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 12:03 AM

Damn it Kuroishi, nobody wants to hear that.

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 12:42 AM

FullMetal Haruko wrote:And the Wiki also says the Rah was influenced by 5 other Animes such as Gundam SEED. Saysing the Rah is a copy of Evangelin is a shot in the dark at best.

How is RahXephon influenced by Gundam SEED? RahXephon aired before SEED. SEED is no influence, nothing is really original about it, its almost like a remake of Mobile Suit Gundam.


The 1975 Tomino anime Raideen I think is the main influence for RahXephon, the creator even said it was. Just like Anno said Tomino's 1980 Ideon was the biggest influene for Evangelion.

"Plot: Raideen, the giant robot-like protector of the lost continent of Mu, senses the evil presence and awakens within its golden pyramid, revealing to young Japanese boy Akira Hibiki that he is the one descendant of the ancient Mu people who must help Raideen save Earth.

He assisted by his friends, token girl Mari Sakurano (daughter of a scientist fighting the Demon Empire) and several members of his high school soccer team."



Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 02:11 AM

I would say no. I have only seen about half of Raxephon and all of Eva but I don't think that they are the same. There are some similarities but its different overall.

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 03:55 AM

I've made a page on my website responding to a lot of the criticism that it's recieved. It should clear up any misunderstandings.

http://evaxephon.com/FRC.html

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 04:00 AM

"RahXephon was copying Yuusha Raideen, and Evangelion was copying Nadesico."

Shouldn't it be "and Evangelion was copying Ideon."? Nadesico is a parody show of mostly Super Robot anime. Its nothing like Evangelion. And most of all it aired after Evangelion so that line doesn't make sense.



"RahXephon specifically borrowed THESE aspects from Evangelion, rather than aspects that are typical of the giant robot genre."

And Evangelion specifically borrowed aspects from Ideon....

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 04:11 AM

If by "it should clear up any misunderstandings" you mean "it's my way of ignoring criticism without responding to or even acknowledging it", then that page is spot on. Brilliant stuff. I was moved.

I'm all for your right to make your own site, post your theories and come to whatever conclusions you want. Really. That's your affair. Some people misinterpret Cowboy Bebop to be 6 episodes of story and 20 episodes of filler. That's their right. You've done what you think is objective analysis of the Rah->Eva connection. Bully for you.

But...

If you ever hope to have the bulk of the members on this board take anything you say even remotely seriously, then you have to engage in real dialogue. You can't just toss out an opinion with which almost everyone disagrees, bury your head in the sand when they point out why, then expect they'll take you seriously afterwards. Just why you should bother with this exercise when you clearly don't want to listen to or acknowledge a disagreeing opinion (no matter how well supported) is beyond me.

Of course, if you ever want to entertain the notion that you're mistaken, I'm sure there are a number of people here who'd love to discuss that with you.

There's a difference between two mindsets:

1) Coming up with a hypothesis and only seeking out evidence which supports the claim while ignoring the rest.

2) Coming up with a hypothesis, then combing through all available data to see if the hypothesis is warranted.

You've done the former. The latter is the one you'll be required to do in real life if you intend to pursue any form of science, law, critical analysis or... well, pretty much anything. I suppose the former approach qualifies you to be a pundit somewhere. Maybe a 'political blogger', even.

Good luck with your site, which will undoubtedly be referenced from time to time on AN for a laugh. I salute you.

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 04:22 AM

EvaXephon wrote:And many of those surface-level, cosmetic similarities lay on top of the plot being the same,

The plots are not identical, as CrossboneGundam summarized.

scenes occuring in the same order in the same episode,

But most of the similarities you've listed on your site do not "occur in the same order in the same episode". Examples:

Reika wears a long yellow dress - RahXephon ep. 01
Asuka wears a long yellow dress - Evangelion ep. 08

Daring rescue - RahXephon ep. 01
Daring Rescue - Evangelion ep. 25' (EoE)

etc. etc. etc.

dialouge being the same at the same points in the series,

Are you a fluent speaker of Japanese? If not, you're not in a position to make these sort of claims.

and characters resembling each other for a reason.

Prove this, or I shall consider you a liar.

Pointing out differences doesn't erase similarities.

No, but storyline differences prove that Rah is not an Evangelion rip-off.

I went to bed. As you can see, I'm back, and defusing everyone's posts.

...And selectively ignoring most of the comments and questions directed at you in the process, I see.

If I said that Rah was a clone because of ONE similarity, I'd be a fool.

Instead, I used 165 COMBINED similarities.

You pulled that number out of your arse and act as if it's an authoritative source. Pathetic. How many of these "165 similarities" of yours are properly peer-reviewed and generally accepted as intentional NGE-references?

I've made a page on my website responding to a lot of the criticism that it's recieved. It should clear up any misunderstandings.

http://evaxephon.com/FRC.html

One more question you might want to add there: "You do realize that pretty much nobody agrees with your views, and numerous people also think that you are a delusional, flamebaiting fanboy?

soulreaper wrote:Looks like you're not the only one who can take random scenes and paste them together into an unholy mixture of RahVangelion-ness

Nice AMV, although I like EvaBebop better. Here's a Love Hina version.

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 05:00 AM

As if the creators of RahXephon would think "Hey, lets make these doors close on Haruka since they closed on Misato" or "Lets add embers fly by the mecha like in Evangelion". There such small details! What idiot would go through the trouble of copying such tiny details?

A lot of what you say are very common in mecha anime, like the "I'll never pilot again" thing that the teen mecha pilot says for example.

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 05:06 AM

Levon wrote:Shouldn't it be "and Evangelion was copying Ideon."? Nadesico is a parody show of mostly Super Robot anime. Its nothing like Evangelion. And most of all it aired after Evangelion so that line doesn't make sense.

Oh, whoops. That was an accident, then. I'll edit that part. Thanks for letting me know.

Levon wrote:"RahXephon specifically borrowed THESE aspects from Evangelion, rather than aspects that are typical of the giant robot genre."

And Evangelion specifically borrowed aspects from Ideon....

Irrelevant. I've already explained why.

Leader Desslock wrote:If by "it should clear up any misunderstandings" you mean "it's my way of ignoring criticism without responding to or even acknowledging it", then that page is spot on.

I don't respond to or acknowledge things that are irrelevant to the discussion at hand.

Leader Desslock wrote:bury your head in the sand when they point out why

Once again, I simply don't respond to any comments that I believe have no merit at all.

A note.

One side of this discussion is constantly flinging around condescending, insulting remarks, and generally being rude.

The other side is not doing any of the above things.

Which one of these two sides looks mature and grown up?

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 05:15 AM

EvaXephon wrote:I don't respond to or acknowledge things that are irrelevant to the discussion at hand...Once again, I simply don't respond to any comments that I believe have no merit at all.

Thus far, you have yet to respond to anything which substantially contradicted your opinion.

Tell you what - let's stop this now. How about you give us a list of what you think have been the MERITORIOUS contradictory opinions listed thus far in this thread. We can start from there.

EvaXephon wrote:One side of this discussion is constantly flinging around condescending, insulting remarks, and generally being rude.

The other side is not doing any of the above things.

Which one of these two sides looks mature and grown up?

You're right. Here's an example: "If you think so, you obviously only read one or two pages and didn't bother reading my commentary" Care to guess who said that? You don't see the condescension dripping off that?

The mature and grown up side of the argument is the one that's considering the other side's opinion, choosing to accept/reject it based on the TOTAL evidence at hand, then supporting their position with examples. Guess which side's doing that?

If you'd like all of us to shut up while the two or three Evangelion/Tomino/Anno experts go toe to toe with you, we can do that. You let us know what works best for you. Really. I'm pretty sure this group is willing to accomodate whatever debate format you choose - as long as it's a genuine debate. If you're gonna clap your hands over your ears while you receive the point-by-point refutation of your claims, then we've pretty much demonstrated which side has the most merit, haven't we?

I'd just love to sit on the sidelines and watch. This'd be hilarious.


HOWEVER - since I hate to miss out on a good debate myself, I'd like to point out that I was entirely civil when I pointed out the following:

YOU: It doesn't matter if Eva copied another anime. That's irrelevant. The issue here is that RahXephon copied Eva. That is not changed if Eva copied something else.

ME: No, that doesn't follow logically. What if they both copied the same things? Then you'd see all the same similarities, but RahXephon wouldn't have copied Eva at all.

I pointed out how your conclusion (RahXephon copied Evangelion) was not the only logical conclusion that could be reached by your evidence. One would also expect to see the same similarities if RahXephon copied the same inspirations as Evangelion. This, it would seem, is a flaw in your argument that you are choosing to overlook, despite the fact it was pointed out to you in a civil manner.

If as you say you are "really interested in hearing someone try to tell me that RahXephon is not a complete clone of Evangelion", then it would seem that this is precisely the sort of flaw you would wish to address.

If on the other hand you are NOT interested in hearing conflicting opinions (which is what the bulk of your responses - and lack thereof - would indicate), then I have to fall in line with several of the other participants in this thread and dismiss your conclusions as fanboy flamebait, and little else.

You want a serious debate? Bring it. We'll oblige.

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 05:26 AM

By the way, guess what EvaXephon's website copied?

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 06:46 AM

Dr. Nick wrote:By the way, guess what EvaXephon's website copied?

WOW

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 07:36 AM

Dr. Nick wrote:Nice AMV, although I like EvaBebop better. Here's a Love Hina version.

Awesome!

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 08:19 AM

GAH! This thread makes My EYES BLEED. Im off to make a website about how Evangelion Copied Gigantor... Now all I need is the Evangeling Into Song and the beginning to Gigantor.....

Originally posted on: 07.22.2006, 08:40 AM