Why Angels + Adam = 3I?

[AuraTwilight]

The only necessary part of an Impact is Adam (or Lilith). If an Angel merges with Adam's body, they effectively become her, with their own soul in charge. Thus, Impact. You're going against things we know to be true here; we have many reasons to think this is the case but no reasons to doubt it like you're doing.

[Oral Stage]

If the Angel+Adam can't cause an impact, then the lie would still be useful to dupe funding from world leaders for Project E, which definitely could cause an impact.

If an Angel merges with Adam's body, they effectively become her, with their own soul in charge.

^ and what about when Gendou merges with Adam's body? Does he count as an angel? His soul was no doubt in charge of Adam's body. What about the tree of life? That obviously wasn't completely superfluous. 3I didn't begin proper until Lillith had absorbed Adam's body (an embryo, presumably containing a developing S2 engine) and the Tree of Life.
2I was the result of a Lillith based Angel merging with Adam while the Spear of Longinus watched.
If it were as simple as putting a soul into a Seed, then Gendou could have dived into the giant marshmallow he had nailed to the cross under Hakone. Indeed, his wife tried this and wound up as a God that could be subdued by purple armour plating.

[AuraTwilight]

If the Angel+Adam can't cause an impact, then the lie would still be useful to dupe funding from world leaders for Project E, which definitely could cause an impact.

But if it's a lie, then why lie to Kaworu about where Adam is? Why use Lilith as a diversion to reroute the Angels? Adam will do just as good.

The NGE2 game also shoots down your theory because if you let an Angel reach Adam, an Impact happens. The game is also canonical.

^ and what about when Gendou merges with Adam's body? Does he count as an angel?

No, he doesn't. He is not Adam's child, just like the Angels are not Lilith's children. Gendo doesn't even have an S2 Engine so he can't do the Angelic merger shenanigans.

What about the tree of life? That obviously wasn't completely superfluous. 3I didn't begin proper until Lillith had absorbed Adam's body (an embryo, presumably containing a developing S2 engine) and the Tree of Life.

Merging Adam and Lilith is an entirely different sort of Impact. Adam+Angel and equivalent just causes the revived Seed of Life to kill everything so it can repopulate the planet. Adam+Lilith allows for the elevating of all souls to an altered state of existence and possibly the restructuring of local reality. It's not comparable.

2I was the result of a Lillith based Angel merging with Adam while the Spear of Longinus watched.

No, it was the result of waking up Adam. The injection of Lilith-based DNA caused Adam to become unstable and explode before she could finish the task, and may have contributed to the birth of Kaworu.

If it were as simple as putting a soul into a Seed, then Gendou could have dived into the giant marshmallow he had nailed to the cross under Hakone. Indeed, his wife tried this and wound up as a God that could be subdued by purple armour plating.

Lilim do not work that way. Only Adam's Angels can interface with other organisms in this way, such as when Armisael attempts to merge with Unit 00 and use it as an interface to revive its siblings.

[Linh]

But if it's a lie, then why lie to Kaworu about where Adam is? Why use Lilith as a diversion to reroute the Angels? Adam will do just as good.

The point is that the Angels don't need Lilith and they want to reunite with Adam, their mother. If they didn't lie to Kaworu where Adam is, it wouldn't lead to him descending into the Terminal Dogma and being annihilated by Eva Unit 01. Same goes for the other Angels. Beside, Adam had been taken away by Gendo for his own scenario.

The NGE2 game also shoots down your theory because if you let an Angel reach Adam, an Impact happens. The game is also canonical.

I haven't read about the game yet, but if it's so, okay. But if we put aside the game, theory of "Angel+Adam" being a lie still has possibilities, right?

No, it was the result of waking up Adam. The injection of Lilith-based DNA caused Adam to become unstable and explode before she could finish the task, and may have contributed to the birth of Kaworu.

I don't really see the difference, since Adam woke up as the result of the Contact Experiment, which is performed by a human and Adam and lead to the injection that you've said.

[Oral Stage]

The NGE2 game also shoots down your theory because if you let an Angel reach Adam, an Impact happens. The game is also canonical.

Source. My understanding is that Rei merged with Lillith before any Angel could merge with it.

[AuraTwilight]

I said Adam, not Lilith...

[Reichu]

I wasn't aware you could let an Angel "reach Adam" in NGE2...

[Lurkis]

Regardless of whether or not Kaworu reaching Adam would cause 3I, wouldn't his reason for wanting to return to Adam be to return the soul to the original body?

Anyway, I'm not saying Adam+Angel doesn't = 3I but when does it say an Angels soul would take place inside Adam to reawaken it? If that is the case, then couldn't a Lilith based life form merge with her to give her a soul and reawaken her? Of course Lilith wouldn't cause 3I with her children already born, but couldn't Gendo merge directly with Lilith rather than the Rei+Adam+Lilith Scenario?

I'm just saying if it would work for Adam and an Angel then why not Lilin and Lilith? Or if it would work for both then why wouldn't Gendo just merge with Lilith Immediately after the Angels were killed?

[AuraTwilight]

I wasn't aware you could let an Angel "reach Adam" in NGE2...

I remember seeing a walkthrough fail the Gagheil fight to show something to that effect, but in fairness i'm basing this on memories from like 2009. If I'm mistaken, well shit lol.

I was mostly basing that statement on the Classified Information anyway.

Regardless of whether or not Kaworu reaching Adam would cause 3I, wouldn't his reason for wanting to return to Adam be to return the soul to the original body?

He claims all Angels have this instinct, though, and that fulfilling it will doom the Lilim.

Anyway, I'm not saying Adam+Angel doesn't = 3I but when does it say an Angels soul would take place inside Adam to reawaken it? If that is the case, then couldn't a Lilith based life form merge with her to give her a soul and reawaken her? Of course Lilith wouldn't cause 3I with her children already born, but couldn't Gendo merge directly with Lilith rather than the Rei+Adam+Lilith Scenario?

Being with a soul merges with a body that doesn't. Figure it out. :P

And like I already described, Lilin do not work that way. Angels have the ability to shapeshift however they please, and merge with each other willy-nilly; it is infact their main form of communication. Lilim, however, are stuck with the bodies they have.

Even if they could, though, there's no benefit to it. Lilith's children already populate the planet, so there is no instinct for us to do so, and no benefit. The Impact would wipe ALL life on the planet in order to reset it.

I'm just saying if it would work for Adam and an Angel then why not Lilin and Lilith? Or if it would work for both then why wouldn't Gendo just merge with Lilith Immediately after the Angels were killed?

Take a minute to consider the fact that even with Adam's body, Gendo needed Rei for the process.

[Reichu]

I remember seeing a walkthrough fail the Gagheil fight to show something to that effect, but in fairness i'm basing this on memories from like 2009. If I'm mistaken, well shit lol.

I don't recall anything particularly interesting happening when you lose to Gaghiel in the PSP version (the only version where you can fight him) besides a "look, you failed at a lame reflex mini-game, haha!" game over. But if I learn differently, of course I'll report it to the forum

[AuraTwilight]

Then maybe I'm getting my wires crossed or the video was deliberately edited to give it a more "in-depth ending" or some shit. If I find the video again I'll post it in the relevant thread. Until then, just reference my comment via Classified Information; my point's still valid.

[Xavierla]

The reason why the angels coming into Adam would cause an impact to occur is simple common sense really. Imagine an adult crawling back inside of his mother and they were both aging in reverse. This would cause the mother to go back to a time where she was not pregnant. Adam arrived on Earth first. He was going to fill the world with angels until Lilith showed up. An angel coming in contact with him would cause life and time to go in reverse to a time before Lilith's arrival. This isn't the case for lilin because 1) they have developed to much and don't have enough of Lilith in them to do something like that. And 2) they Lilith came after Adam. This would not destroy the angels because no matter what the lilin did, Adam would always be there therefore time can't move backward to a point where Adam is not there and there is only Lilith.

[AuraTwilight]

...That is not how anything works ever.

[user-02]

The real issue here is that all Impact events are not equal. There are different scenarios for an Impact, with very different outcomes. Impacts are not interchangeable, and the components to start any given type of Impact are not fungible. Mix up the recipe, and you mix up the result.

The crucial step for an Impact's outcome seems to be the type of soul involved as the catalyst. Gendo is seeking to be the driver of 3I, so that it can occur on his terms. Whether or not he personally wants to be the soul catalyst, or whether he needs Shinji to be, is not entirely clear. Either way, he wants to bring about a Lilim-soul-mediated Impact, and to that end, he seems to think it matters which Lilim soul is in the driver's seat. (Probably because, as we see with the events in EoE, the catalyst soul has a large degree of control over the final outcome).

An Adam-mediated Impact, on the other hand, would probably be a purely destructive event for the Lilim (as was 2I).