Misato's relationship with Shinji in 3.0

[Hyper Shinchan]

In that case, throwing him into a cell with a sedative would've been better.

It still wouldn't have worked, Gendo just had to send ReiQ, kidnap him, tell him that Misato kept him inside a cell under sedatives and here you go, Shinji wouldn't have trusted that bitch any more.

There were two solutions imo:
1. Killing him. But he's the protagonist.
2. Explaining him calmly and nicely, why he shouldn't pilot an Eva any more, instead of just telling him "there's no need for you to pilot an Eva again, I'll kill you if you try to do it". But Eva has never worked in this way, it's because people don't try to talk to each other and explain themselves that shit always happens.

[bobbyfischer's ghost]

Didn't Sakura one of the nicest characters tell him to never pilot?

[Hyper Shinchan]

Didn't Sakura one of the nicest characters tell him to never pilot?

She didn't say "why".

[esselfortium]

It still wouldn't have worked, Gendo just had to send ReiQ, kidnap him, tell him that Misato kept him inside a cell under sedatives and here you go, Shinji wouldn't have trusted that bitch any more.

Because if there's anyone Shinji still has every reason to trust at this point, it's dear old dad.

[Hyper Shinchan]

Because if there's anyone Shinji still has every reason to trust at this point, it's dear old dad.

From his point of view, yes. He doesn't know what we know about Gendo's plots.

[Darkwing]

Lets face it, almost Everyone in Eva needed therapy to start with. By the time it's done there aren't enough therepests in 50 alternate earths to treat them.

[bobbyfischer's ghost]

She didn't say "why".

I'm sorry but couldn't Sakura just say: "So you don't cause the deaths of more people, like my brother."

I know she's nice but still..

[Ynnead]

I'm sorry but couldn't Sakura just say: "So you don't cause the deaths of more people, like my brother."

I know she's nice but still..

Telling a kid he accidentally killed millions of people isn't exactly easy for either side.

[bobbyfischer's ghost]

I'm not saying it's easy, but when that kid is going to do it again well....

[Kestrel]

It'd be weird as fuck if he was the only one to die in that area.

Anyway this stuff about Eva-like creatures sounds interesting but it's also really confusing.

It would indeed be weird, but.. Plausible.

It explains Misato's current contempt toward Shinji. Love/Hate relationship, where she holds him accountable, but realized that he's in some ways not responsible for what NERV was forcing him to do.

And to build upon that, it probably drives her to be the current hardass that she is. Before, she admittedly was pushing Shinji to do the thing he hated the most.

She said, "Don't make others suffer for your personal hatred."

Misato, previously seeking revenge against the Angels, now takes a more aggressive role, almost Gendo like, in being driven to eliminate the Evangelions. Ironically, the title almost works for her. You can (not) redo.

[Xard]

Doesn't really work out because Kaji is alive and well at the time Kaworu pierces Shinji from behind and ends Third Impact. This holds regardless of 3rd Impact's locality/globality in scale because in both scenarios Geofront was quite safe.


Kaji may have kicked the bucket in years between or he may return in 4.0 but if something got him it wasn't 3I


Besides, Misato's contempt for Shinji doesn't need anything more than 3I and Shinji being a sad little shit about it

[Kestrel]

Doesn't really work out because Kaji is alive and well at the time Kaworu pierces Shinji from behind and ends Third Impact. This holds regardless of 3rd Impact's locality/globality in scale because in both scenarios Geofront was quite safe.


Kaji may have kicked the bucket in years between or he may return in 4.0 but if something got him it wasn't 3I


Besides, Misato's contempt for Shinji doesn't need anything more than 3I and Shinji being a sad little shit about it

Ahh.. Didn't recall him watching the spearing. I'm still curious if he was somehow killed in relation to the 3I activities.

I still don't think Misato's contempt is justified for Shinji just yet. Shinji himself didn't seem to be anywhere close to understanding the consequences of his actions when he dove in to save Rei. How could Misato fault him for trying to save one of his comrades? I still think something happened in those 14 years that has left her fairly heartless, and the Third Impact itself isn't anywhere near sufficient to explain that.

I'm seriously interested in the 14 years we missed. How we arrived at the present day could make all the difference in the world.

[SenorSquiid]

The boy's got problems, and yes if Eva took place in a perfect climate controlled world Misato could have got him a shrink and some ice cream and respected his culture shock after she's spent the last 14 years trying to clean up the 2nd apocalypse she's seen in her lifetime. But she didn't, and the boy's a walking Apocalypse Machine and a danger to the whole planet. Some failsafes and resentment, and a little misplaced self-loathing are to be expected.

[Hyper Shinchan]

Seriously though, in case you don't remember I sat on the fence whether or not Shinji's actions were supposed to be viewed as heroic or not through all this time waiting for 3.0 to answer the ambiguous question.

The problem here is less about his actions, I've to suck it up and accept that they were not supposed to be viewed under any kind of positive light, but Misato's reaction to his actions, I don't like that someone who encouraged him now go around passing "judgement" upon Shinji (Ritsuko uses the word 罰).

[Xard]

The problem here is less about his actions, I've to suck it up and accept that they were not supposed to be viewed under any kind of positive light, but Misato's reaction to his actions, I don't like that someone who encouraged him now go around passing "judgement" upon Shinji (Ritsuko uses the word 罰).

That's a complaint about Misato that I've seen a lot with Japanese, yeah. Which is given because they think in the same way.

I enter self-quote game again:




I should now also deal with Misato question, namely his supposed hypocritical "support" for Shinji vs her now scorn for him. That's easy to debunk:

Misato at this point isn't aware of what's going to happen. Her point is simple enough: Shinji is doing something as autonomic individual and not in order to please someone or be a fucking tool. That's worth cheering for.



When she realizes what exactly the kid is going to do though:



So no, Misato obviously was not in favour of Shinji triggering Third Impact.


it's like viewers only remember the momentary encouragement part and not the "awwwwwww shit shit shit shit" reactions that followed for rest of the scene

[Hyper Shinchan]

So no, Misato obviously was not in favour of Shinji triggering Third Impact.

This is just plainly ridiculous. No one said that. No one was in favour of 3rd Impact, not even Shinji. She was essentially in his identical position, they know too little about what's going on to say "hey! Let's stop now because it could be dangerous". She encouraged him until it was just too late to undo anything, so she can't call herself apart just because Shinji was the one who caused this mess, probably she would have done the same in his shoes. Thus Misato is an hypocrite and a bitch.
EDIT: almost forgot it, she's also evil.

[Xard]

This is just plainly ridiculous. No one said that. No one was in favour of 3rd Impact, not even Shinji.

Wrong.

Rei

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v

World.


If Shinji wasn't ready to sacrifice the world for Rei 3I wouldn't have triggered in the first place as it always realizes the wish and state of mind of the key agent that determines what happens

She was essentially in his identical position, they know too little about what's going on to say "hey! Let's stop now because it could be dangerous". She encouraged him until it was just too late to undo anything, so she can't call herself apart just because Shinji was the one who caused this mess, probably she would have done the same in his shoes. Thus Misato is an hypocrite and a bitch.

(now ignoring that Misato probably has somewhat split feelings on the subject that may get explored after Shinji meets with Misato again) It doesn't really work like that. We don't see Misato's words have any effect on Shinji at all because he really doesn't give a fuck about anyone else's words at that point. Misato's words are more than anything a way to let audience know Shinji is acting as self-determining individual for his own end rather than trying to win favours with anyone or please Gendo or [insert other traits of Shinji's modus operandi till now]

Just like, once again, in climax for 4.0

Misato actually gets the "didn't know what the fuck she was doing" pass. Shinji on the other hand doesn't and that's because the cunt not probably entirely cogently wanted for Third Impact as long as it gives him teh Rei

[CJD]

This, uhh, review is what happens when people get 2.0's climax all wrong.

I got 2.0's climax all wrong? Because even after reading what you've posted that's what I've been saying all weekend: Misato, ignorant of the risks, egged him on. When she found out the risks she backed down, but hindsight is 20/20. To blame Shinji for causing 3I when he was just as ignorant as you is absurdly hypocritical.

SPOILER: Show

That's a complaint about Misato that I've seen a lot with Japanese, yeah. Which is given because they think in the same way.

I enter self-quote game again:




I should now also deal with Misato question, namely his supposed hypocritical "support" for Shinji vs her now scorn for him. That's easy to debunk:

Misato at this point isn't aware of what's going to happen. Her point is simple enough: Shinji is doing something as autonomic individual and not in order to please someone or be a fucking tool. That's worth cheering for.



When she realizes what exactly the kid is going to do though:



So no, Misato obviously was not in favour of Shinji triggering Third Impact.


it's like viewers only remember the momentary encouragement part and not the "awwwwwww shit shit shit shit" reactions that followed for rest of the scene

Again, her reaction after the fact is after the fact.

Honestly, Shinchan puts it best and anything I say in this post is just going to be repeating what he said.

If Shinji wasn't ready to sacrifice the world for Rei 3I wouldn't have triggered in the first place as it always realizes the wish and state of mind of the key agent

That's a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge assumption your making here.

(now ignoring that Misato probably has somewhat split feelings on the subject that may get explored after Shinji meets with Misato again) It doesn't really work like that. We don't see Misato's words have any effect on Shinji at all because he really doesn't give a fuck about anyone else's words at that point. Misato's words are more than anything a way to let audience know Shinji is acting as self-determining individual for his own end rather than trying to win favours with anyone or please Gendo or [insert other traits of Shinji's modus operandi till now]

That's all irrelevant though. Short of the words not being hers the fact is when she knew just as little information as Shinji she was calling for the exact same decision as Shinji. The problem isn't that she encouraged him, because he probably never heard her, it's that she supported the decision. Yes, it's very clear after 3I starts that she's against 3I, but that's after 3I starts. With the exact same information as Shinji she makes the exact same call, and then she hates and treats Shinji like shit for it.

[esselfortium]

I got 2.0's climax all wrong? Because even after reading what you've posted that's what I've been saying all weekend: Misato, ignorant of the risks, egged him on. When she found out the risks she backed down, but hindsight is 20/20. To blame Shinji for causing 3I when he was just as ignorant as you is absurdly hypocritical.

Misato was a bystander who had absolutely no control or influence over Shinji's decisions there. She wasn't the one piloting the Eva; she has no responsibility.

[Hyper Shinchan]

If Shinji wasn't ready to sacrifice the world for Rei 3I wouldn't have triggered in the first place as it always realizes the wish and state of mind of the key agent

Still this thing... Did anyone consider that he wasn't sacrificing the world but his own presence in the world? "I don't care about the world" can be read in this way too, he didn't care about his possibility of remaining human and interacting with others. I see a big difference between this, essentially what Yui did, and saying "I'll kill everyone coz I want Ayanami back" which never looked like Shinji's intent to me.
EDIT: in fact this is exactly what Ritusko told him, you won't become human again.

She wasn't the one piloting the Eva; she has no responsibility.

She's in no position to pass judgement on Shinji though.