Computer Help

[anatrok]

My computer is acting...batshit-insane. Help me, sir, wont'cha.

Let me explain. About a month and a half ago I system restored my computer, cause it was acting weird...little did I know (well I did know, just wasn't thinking properly) that it would wipe out my documents(but not my program files, funnily enough). Well recently I found I was running out of space on my hard drive, which to me made no sense, since I don't have that many files anymore. So I looked at my hard drive

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/Anatrok/Cdrive.jpg

Said I had a little more then 2 gigs out of 180...which was kinda weird, I looked at my documents to see if I had that much stuff an no, about 40 gigs, same thing with program files, about 40 gigs

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/Anatrok/Cdrive2.jpg

So by this screen my entire C drive should have 80 gigs

So, stupidly I figured, ok let's do a disk defrag, and I looked at the analysis report, to see if I could glean the problem, and I thought I did.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/Anatrok/diskdefrag.jpg

And now I'm like OMFG, there's my files I had lost...but the problem is they aren't really there...at least in windows.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/Anatrok/userdata.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/Anatrok/userdatadenied.jpg

So, two questions, First, If I could get these files, that would be awesome, I have so many pictures, and I have no real ones anymore because of "evil" Katrina. And my awesome eva odds and ends collection would be nice to get back. Second, if it's completely impossible to get those files, can I at least get my space back...cause losing a complete 100 gigs is kinda lame.

Many thanks in advance, and help would be immensely appreciated.

[superdoughboy4]

Have you tried going to the directories the Disc Defragment reported?

[anatrok]

yes...see the access denied, and the window saying there empty?

*not being cocky, I apreciate the help*

[superdoughboy4]

Oh. That's what you were leading to.
Hmm...
Ask Titus.
Other than that, I'll think about the problem and how to resolve it.

[drinian]

I have a few questions for you. One, you said you should have 180 gigs total. I know that the hp recovery partition doesn't take that much space, so was that a misstype?

Two, when you say you did a system restore, you mean recovered from the hp recovery partition, right? Not that you rolled back your system using the internal windows state rollback utility.

I also have a suggestion to get those files back. You're going to need to burn a Linux LiveCD, like, for instance, Knoppix: http://www.knoppix.org/. When you put this in the drive and reboot your computer, a full Linux environment will boot off of the CD (this doesn't write to your hard drive). Knoppix should automatically mount your NTFS partitions, in this case, drive c. To find them, have a look somewhere under the directory /mnt.

Yes, that's right. The best way to look at your Windows files is from Linux.

If you get that far and see your files, come back and ask for help on how to get them out (unless you're more familiar with Linux than I suspect). What kind of removable media do you have, e.g. external hard drives, cd burners, etc.?

As a final piece of advice, don't ever, ever use the HP system restore utils if you don't have to. If you have a real copy of Windows XP, install that instead (and make sure to set up an external firewall to keep your machine from getting 0wned before you can run Windows Update!)

[superdoughboy4]

Don't trust HP at all.

I heard in one of the 2000s, that everyone's computer bought in that year, was infected with a Trojan or worm due to a very large exploit on their systems.
Or something of that sort.

[drinian]

Don't trust HP at all.

I heard in one of the 2000s, that everyone's computer bought in that year, was infected with a Trojan or worm due to a very large exploit on their systems.
Or something of that sort.

Don't make claims like that without knowing what you're talking about. I'm looking around the Web and I don't see any references to this. Are you suggesting that HP built some sort of backdoor into their systems, or what?

The only exploit dispute I can see has to do with legal action over something to do with SSH in HP-UX. That has nothing to do with personal or Windows machines.

I happen to know that most of the HP-specific add-ons to Windows XP are written, at least these days, in Python, which makes this whole story seem unlikely.

[anatrok]

I think it's a 200 gig HD so
178G Cdrive
7.59G Ddrive(the hp recovery partition)
~~186G total
I don't know where that other 15 gig's went' but it's smaller then 100

I didn't use the window rollback utility, but i dont' belive i used the restore from HP, I like held down the F11 key or something when i restarted and it let me restore from a menu there...if i remember corectly. My memory is clouded by the rage i had after finding out that the files were gone. In anycase, I'm going to go and try the linux thingy....

I have a CD reader, DVD/CD burner, and some media card slots, but thats about it, for removable media.

[superdoughboy4]

Don't trust HP at all.

I heard in one of the 2000s, that everyone's computer bought in that year, was infected with a Trojan or worm due to a very large exploit on their systems.
Or something of that sort.

Don't make claims like that without knowing what you're talking about. I'm looking around the Web and I don't see any references to this. Are you suggesting that HP built some sort of backdoor into their systems, or what?

The only exploit dispute I can see has to do with legal action over something to do with SSH in HP-UX. That has nothing to do with personal or Windows machines.

I happen to know that most of the HP-specific add-ons to Windows XP are written, at least these days, in Python, which makes this whole story seem unlikely.

I mean, not exploit.
It was just a huge hole in the system that gave everyone that bought a computer that specific year from HP.
Two of my friends have experienced it already.
They had got massive Trojans from it.

[Titus]

Here's what id do....

Take a partitioning prog like partition magic 7 or sumthing....

Brows the volumes folders 1 by 1 in dos mode with the app(has the function).

If the files are inexsecable, they'r ghost file that have links and referances to in the registry, but no physical location or files...

If u can get em, copy them to another volume...

- To fix ur problem, easy. Backup everything u can, departition the drive, repartition a full disk and reformat. Reinstall windows and copy the backups. Fix the registry and wholla.... using partition magic to departition and format should take you more than a few minutes, dos takes forever... I know. Iv'e sat and waited for a 400gig hd...

Anyway...

That's what id do.

[anatrok]

i'm gonna have to go with drinian's advice, I don't have another HD, and I lack a windows install disk.

Thanks for the suggestion though.

[Titus]

K. I meant, put it in another pc as a slave, then brows it.....

Hav fun. I know mine worx, but hey, who am I to tell you whats best?

G'd luck

[superdoughboy4]

Well, you are the one that has like, 4 computers.
You'd be experienced in this, what with all your customized and overclocked computers.

[drinian]

I didn't use the window rollback utility, but i dont' belive i used the restore from HP, I like held down the F11 key or something when i restarted and it let me restore from a menu there...if i remember corectly. My memory is clouded by the rage i had after finding out that the files were gone. In anycase, I'm going to go and try the linux thingy....

I'm pretty sure that one of the options from the boot menu is the system restore from the HP partition. I've never used it myself, though. Have you looked under your Start menu to see if there are any utilities from HP that might help you recover these hidden files? What I mean is that HP may have saved them after the restore but kept them intentionally hidden until the user requests to have them back or delete them explicitly. I really have no idea.

I'm not sure what your level of experience is with Linux, so feel free to PM, email, or otherwise contact me if you need more help walking through this first step.

I mean, not exploit.
It was just a huge hole in the system that gave everyone that bought a computer that specific year from HP.
Two of my friends have experienced it already.
They had got massive Trojans from it.

I need to clear up some terminology to continue this discussion. A trojan (from "trojan horse") is a damaging program that masquerades as something else to get on your computer, like an AIM virus pretending to be a link to a photo gallery or something. A virus is something you get involuntarily due to some sort of exploit in the OS. Well, involuntarily is too strong a word -- usually they can be prevented through firewalling and keeping up with Windows Update.

So my guess is that the problem was not with HP but with unpatched vulnerabilities in Windows. If you put a copy of Windows XP on the Internet, with no firewall, and without having run Windows Update since it's been purchased, it is nearly one hundred percent likely that it will get infected with some sort of virus within 15 minutes. I made a lot of money fixing people's computers at school one year because people don't realize this.

Well, you are the one that has like, 4 computers.
You'd be experienced in this, what with all your customized and overclocked computers.

I still can't figure out exactly what he wants to do in the "fix ur problem" part of his post. So don't take Titus' advice until he explains it a little better, please, or I may not be able to help you.

Actually, installing the drive as a slave in another PC might make this experience less painful in terms of transferring files later, but I still want to see what Knoppix can find first before we even discuss that.

[Titus]

"I still can't figure out exactly what he wants to do in the "fix ur problem" part of his post. So don't take Titus' advice until he explains it a little better, please, or I may not be able to help you. "

This is y I grew tired of computers and retired.

Every harddrive has a partition. AKA, the volume of the hard drive. Depending on the size of the disk and the preferance of the owner/user, you can either use a percentage of the whole hd, the whole hd, or split up the hard drive into segments, as in 2 volumes. ie, 1 40Gb hd, with 2 20gb volumes. Effectivly having 2 20 gig hd's in your my computer.

Now. The problem with any pc, is windows. unless the pc doesn't start up or even loads windows, windows is the cause 90% of the time.

To fix anatroks problem(the easiest, less messy way), is:

1)Take the hd to another computer or a friend's computer.
2)Install the hd into the pc as a slave.
3)Boot the pc as normal, loading the pc's os, not yours.(the master drive, aka your friends windows).
4)If he doesn't have it, install Partition Magic(preferably v 7 or upwards..)
5)Load the program
6)Select the drive(hd/volume) that you would to use,- right click on it.
7)Select the option that say(or that you interperate to be) browsing the files on a disk.
8)The program will reboot the pc, but boot a utilty startup prog much like nortons boot from disk thing...
9)Go through the files, 1 by 1.(there is no windows and therefore no restrictions...)
10)It's a user friendly gui similar to windows, so its like browsing ur pc.
11)If the files that Anatrok want's(that he cant access) are real, aka, they exist as valid data(>0kb) than he can copy/cut/move/delete anything and everything, to a location that he desires....
12)If he cant open the file, it's a ghost file that has registry or archive links, but it's corrupted, deleted, misplaced, whatever...
13)Move everything (that you don't want to lose) in your windows, program files, desktop and documents folders to the hd, as in not in the windows folders! - make a new one......On your friends hd, unless your just deleting windows,(which would be easier) you can just make a backup on your current hd.
14)Use partition magic to de-partition the hd or the desired volumes incase it's split up
15)Repartition the hard drive using pm
16)format the hard drive(I can not express the importance of doing this after words...)
17)Click on the apply changes/execute(whatever) button.
18)5 mins later(max) ur reinstalling windows XP/98
19)Ur pc worx, u have/dont have the files u wanted and you didn't loose a thing in the process, cuz all the stuff u need or that's important to you is in the backup folder on the hd, just copy it over.
20)Don't make a backup folder on the hd your doing this to, cuz departitioning kinda screws you.....

Is that explanitory enough for you drinian?

[Space Penis]

I'd have just used fdisk and start from scratch. But then again, I don't think you can do that in XP anymore.

[Titus]

The good old days of win 98 are long gone buddy.

However, that doesn't stop me from having a 98 installed on my system for just these kinds of emergencies

[drinian]

15)Repartition the hard drive using pm
16)format the hard drive(I can not express the importance of doing this after words...)
17)Click on the apply changes/execute(whatever) button.
18)5 mins later(max) ur reinstalling windows XP/98
19)Ur pc worx, u have/dont have the files u wanted and you didn't loose a thing in the process, cuz all the stuff u need or that's important to you is in the backup folder on the hd, just copy it over.
20)Don't make a backup folder on the hd your doing this to, cuz departitioning kinda screws you.....

Is that explanitory enough for you drinian?

There, that's much better. One of the things I've learned while walking people through many, many installs, bugfixes, and general computer problems (mind that I am a senior in college majoring in computer science and president of the Linux Users Group) is that you have to explain the background and take it in small steps so that bad things don't happen.

And now I know why I thought I didn't understand you the first time. You've told Anatrok to repartition and reformat using PartitionMagic at the end of this solution, which is jumping way too far ahead of the issue at hand.

Here's the other problem with that: Most recent HP computers that I've encountered don't come with system restore disks or a Windows XP disk. Yes, they have a license key (although MS refused to recognize one for me once) but no XP system install disk. That means that you either have to use the utility that HP provides to author system restore disks yourself, or find a Windows XP install disk.

To complicate the issue, it's my understanding that XP SP2 license keys won't work with XP SP1 install disks.

And, finally, PartitionMagic costs money and isn't necessary. If you're reinstalling Windows from scratch and only putting Windows on the machine, there are utilities on the install disk to partition the drive. If you're using the HP system restore CDs, they will overwrite the current partition table back to the original configuration (5 GB restore partiton, rest as drive C: ). If you have that Knoppix Linux LiveCD, you can use cfdisk to repartition, although unless you feel like installing Linux that's probably not necessary.

Actually, let me reiterate that. If you use the HP system restore CDs, they will overwrite the partition table currently on the drive. That can be a really bad thing.

But I didn't want to get into any of this reformat/reinstall business before I heard back from Anatrok about whether his data is recoverable. It just confuses the process.

[Titus]

I also mentioned that he didn't have to do that if he just reinstalled it, or fount the stuff he was looking for.

I doubt that win doctor could fix the problem.

But eh.

And if you know how(AND YOU KNOW HOW AND WHERE drinian!) anything is free..... Even windows and linux- whatever....

And HP sux

Never buy pre-built systems....

But let's let him decide huh?

I just thought id post some help. Meh.

Computer science huh? Hows that working out for you?

[drinian]

So I just got back from a full-day Linux Installfest where I had to do a lot of work with Knoppix, and I realized that my instructions weren't 100% accurate (if you're still listening, Anatrok).

Once you've booted Knoppix, you have to mount your Windows volume. Knoppix creates mount directories for this purpose, so you have to become the root user and just issue the mount command. Here's how:

First, bring up a terminal (the name of the program is "Konsole"). At the prompt, type

[code:1]su -[/code:1]

to enter root, then have a look at your "/mnt"directory:

[code:1]ls /mnt[/code:1]

There should be at least one entry in this directory that starts with "hda". For each one of those, mount it:

[code:1]mount /mnt/hda[/code:1]

replacing hda with the actual entry.

Then, you can poke around those directories using ls, or pull up a GUI file browser (Konqueror, in this case) and have a look to see which of your files are there.

And if you know how(AND YOU KNOW HOW AND WHERE drinian!) anything is free..... Even windows and linux- whatever....

Besides the ideological concerns I have over pirating software, I really wouldn't trust any binaries gotten so illegitimately. No guarantee they're not trojaned somehow. Linux, of course, is Free Software anyway.

Computer science huh? Hows that working out for you?

It's a lot of work, but the rewards are amazing. I really like the ability to create I've been given -- four years ago, my coding ability was limited to GW-BASIC and I barely knew the Unix command line. The Linux/Open Source community is something that I'm proud to be part of. It's also a nice balance to my other major (History). Not to mention I'll have less trouble finding a job now...