The Ayanami Connection (-nami debate)

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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The Ayanami Connection (-nami debate)

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Postby TB3 » Mon Aug 03, 2009 12:49 pm

OK, so this is just a quick, off-the-cuff observation that may have been made before, but which I can't find reference to in the forums. If this topic is redundant, please delete it

So, to my point

Rei Ayanami
Asuka Langley Shikinami
Mari Illustrious Makinami

All named for Ayanami-class destroyers of the JMSDF

I just wondered if anyone had made the following connections;

1:
This is first time in Eva that names have been taken from JMSDF ships, rather than IJN ships. Although there was a Ayanami, a Shikinami and a Makinami in the IJN, the fact that these three names were chosen leads to a connection with the JMSDF Ayanami class. Curious - all these years Eva names have been exclusive to vessels of the Imperial Japanese Navy, but now we've got Self-Defence-Force vessels in the bag. Is this random, or does it have meaning

2:
The three female leads are now 'sister-ships' - can anyone see rhyme or reason to this, or was it just so that their names all featured the same character?

Apologies if this is a useless topic, but I am curious as to whether anyone can divine anything from this
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Postby Ornette » Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:17 pm

Been brought up a few times, but scattered:

http://forum.evageeks.org/viewtopic.php?p=260959#260959

http://forum.evageeks.org/viewtopic.php?p=234134#234134

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Postby AuraTwilight » Mon Aug 03, 2009 3:44 pm

They're all Yui-clones, obviously.

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Postby The Invincible Shinji » Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:57 pm

We're still trying to figure this out.
I'm an A/S shipper and Soryu and Shikinami are one in the same.

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Postby Sammaeloo » Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:03 pm

Asuka is a normal human with anger issues.

Rei is a partial clone of a dead woman with the soul of a ancient super-being who has trouble expressing her feelings.

Mari is a cybernetic alien monster who likes to kill for kicks.
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Postby BattleMonkey » Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:24 pm

Sammaeloo wrote:Mari is a cybernetic alien monster who likes to kill for kicks.


Image

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Postby Sammaeloo » Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:48 pm

^ Either she is some kind of monster, a FAR related creature, a modified Eva clone, or some kind of robot. She is definitely not a normal human being, if she's human at all.
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Postby wonderluster » Mon Aug 03, 2009 8:47 pm

Seems more human than Rei. If I were Gendo, I'd make a Rei for when I get home. And I would program her to give the worlds best massages.
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Postby NemZ » Mon Aug 03, 2009 9:12 pm

My theory: They're all some sort of designed beings, 'clones' in the same non-identical fashion that the eva are clones.

Rei is explained by her despair over her disposable nature. Asuka is driven as she is to prove that she is in fact a valuable individual. Mari sees her clone-hood as liberating, since it means she can evade just about any consequences that might result from her nuttiness. We don't know enough about Kaworu yet to judge. Shinji is the only one who doesn't know he's just one in a series... and probably on life #2 already (Ramiel probably did kill him with that first shot, hence the 'bacta tank' scene as they prepped a fresh body).
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Postby LiLi » Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:01 am

I do tend to think there's some kind of meaning behind the naming of the pilot girls, as if they're part of a designed "series" - it could also tie in to their being considered like weapons of sorts by Nerv/SEELE...?

In my mind, the first association that came up was probably one of tanks full of clones of each -nami girl... lots of Asuka's, Rei's and Mari's.

However, it could also be that each of them - except Ayanami - is a unique "specimen" within the -nami series...

Anyway. I counted 5 open coffins on the moon (including Kaworu).
I realize there might be more that haven't been shown, but I guess supposing each coffin used to hold a Boy or a Girl in the series makes for as good a fanwank as any other? :tongue:

In this case though, I'm not clear as to what Shinji's real connection to his "parents" would be...

BTW, anyone notice the symmetry between coffins 3 and 5? (hint: look at the lids) Sorry if this sounds incredibly nerdy even by local standards, I guess physicists are hardwired for this sort of stuff... ^^;
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Postby UrsusArctos » Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:38 am

I got the entries in place before the movie came out. Yes, this weird name pattern certainly has been noticed, but what it's for is anyone's guess. Perhaps they're waves pounding on the ship Shinji's struggling to anchor?

http://wiki.evageeks.org/Historical_Warships_in_Evangelion#IJN_Ayanami.28.E7.B6.BE.E6.B3.A2.29

Ayanami was the first of her subclass, not of her class.

http://wiki.evageeks.org/Historical_Warships_in_Evangelion#IJN_Shikinami.28.E6.95.B7.E6.B3.A2.29

Shikinami has an interesting oddity. She was the second ship in Ayanami's subclass, but completed a good six months before her, so she was effectively the first of the subclass rather than the second. Had Ayanami not been ordered first, all the Fubuki type-IIs would be "Shikinamis" and not "Ayanamis".

http://wiki.evageeks.org/Historical_Warships_in_Evangelion#IJN_Makinami.28.E5.B7.BB.E6.B3.A2.29

Makinami, for whom Mari is named, was a Yugumo-class destroyer, and not a sister ship of the other two.
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Postby TB3 » Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:29 am

UrsusArctos wrote:Ayanami was the first of her subclass, not of her class.

Makinami, for whom Mari is named, was a Yugumo-class destroyer, and not a sister ship of the other two.


Yes, the three IJN ships were not related, but what I'm getting at is that there was ALSO an Ayanami, a Shikinami and a Makinami in the Japanese Maritime Self Defence Force - they were anti-submarine destroyers in the Ayanami class which entered service in the 1960s and were decomissioned in the 80/90s

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayanami_class_destroyer

Ayanami was the first vessel
Shikinami was the fourth (the middle child)
Makinami was the seventh and last

That's what I found interesting, the fact that these are not just names of historical IJN vessels, but also more recent sisterships in the JMSDF
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Postby UrsusArctos » Tue Aug 04, 2009 10:38 am

The first, the fourth and the seventh. Great find.
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Postby NemZ » Tue Aug 04, 2009 12:40 pm

I found that months ago, and pointed it out twice with no community interest (though Ornette apparently took note ^_^ )

I also mentioned that as sub-hunters, their primary armament is in the form of Hedgehog anti-sub mortars. Perhaps Anno also chose these anti-sub ships in expressing his distaste for the new Soryu being a sub?
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Postby Otakon 08 Ikari » Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:06 pm

So what I can gather is that your saying that the girls are all clones, just not Rei. The horrible thing is since this is rebuild I truly can not give a positive yes or no on rather I believe this or not.
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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:19 pm

I'm not buying the clone thing (with Mari and Asuka, Shinji too) until I get evidence in Rebuild itself.
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Postby NemZ » Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:27 pm

I freely admit it's mostly fanwank at this point, but after 2.0 you have to admit just about anything could happen here.
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Postby User-iel » Thu Aug 06, 2009 3:56 am

@Nemz and @LiLi - I very much like the odds of a fully up front synthetic pilot trope. Nice call. I was trying to pick out the meaning of the character differences from the series, and if all of them are Newtype... (or rather, Fraternity), this would fit better so far. Since Anno will have to subvert it once you suspend your disbelief. The naming series should be a word game extension of the idea. Or just patriotic shout-outs to the current naval forces, as they enjoy even greater public image this decade.

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The "-nami" debate

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Postby Guy Nacks » Fri May 24, 2013 12:30 am

I'm surprised there isn't already a thread for this but anyways.....

By now we all know that Mari, Asuka and Rei have some type of connection with their respective last names:

Ayanami
ShikiNAMI
MakiNAMI

Supposedly, according Miyamura, their meaning is a "big secret" and will probably be revealed in Final (one would hope). But until then, speculation ahoy.

Until recently, I wasn't sure how to approach this, but now I'm almost certain:

Mari, Asuka, and Rei are all clones and/or genetically engineered and have have some kind of connection with the Angels

Rei is a given.

Mari has the same type of wacky "behind the scenes" knowledge that Kaworu has. Plus she REALLY likes LCL....

Asuka's name change from Soryu to Shikinami makes absolutely no sense unless it's a genuine plot point that will be revealed. Anno could have changed her name to literally anything else or kept it as Soryu, but (as a Jap Navy buff) he chooses a specific type of ship that

was actually the first destroyer of Ayanami's subclass to be completed and commissioned despite being ordered six months after the Ayanami (due to Ayanami's slow construction)


If we're to take this to it's narrative equivalent, it would mean that Asuka was engineered in a similar fashion to Rei, probably with more tweaks.

There is also one final trait which connects them all:

SPOILER: Show
Image

Image

Image


FUCKING. GLYPHS.

We're still trying to figure out what the hell they mean beyond being some type of seemingly musically-linked language related to the Angels. But it's a solid connection that seemingly cannot simply be ignored.

Feel free to add in your own thoughts.[/quote]
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Postby NemZ » Fri May 24, 2013 12:46 am

I made this argument back in 2.0 days, and it's only bolstered by finding out that Yui's name was Ayanami as well.

I say Shinji isn't human either, but was a naturally created hybrid rather than fully engineered like the girls. He's actually Shinji_3... the first being killed by Ramiel, the second being lost in 01 and basically re-embodied at the start of the latest film. Hence the BM03 on his foot.
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