Reichu's Revelations: The Biology of Souls

[Reichu [ANF]]

EDIT/DISCLAIMER: I was in a psychologically bizarre place when I began this thread, so I sound kind of like a rotten, egotistic Arschloch in places. Be assured that I was put on new medications as soon as the holidays were over, and Reichu was swiftly returned to her more typical self. Keep this in mind for the initial stages of the thread, and please forgive my unpredictable neurochemistry. Thank you.

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Yes, this thread really will be as awful as it sounds.

I was going to provide a "teaser" for this thread in Part 1, but it ended up being far too drawn-out to belong there. So, I figured I'll create this thread now, leave you with a most cruel and unusual teaser (trust me, the feeling's mutual), and get to bed already.

EXCLUSIVE PREVIEW:
Part 3: A Treatise on Metaphysical Biology

First off, what the hell is 'metaphysical biology'? I'm not quite sure what it's supposed to be in Real Life, but Carl Horn has suggested that it is used by NGE (however subtle the hints may be) to encompass the "pseudoscience" present in the show. Even though things like souls have not been scientifically proven to exist in our own mundane and humdrum world, in the world of NGE this is hardly the case. There is a genuine science behind it all. Is it, in fact, a subdiscipline of science that you can study in college (like, say, Kyoto University?) so that you can babble pretentious-sounding gobbledygook with the best of the Nerv science department -- and actually know what you're talking about?

Now, THERE'S a thought! So, for all intents and purposes, we will assume that this is the case, and use the term "metaphysical biology" to describe the strange science that seems to be beyond everyone else in the NGE world except a handful of weirdoes in labcoats and old geezers in ceremonial robes. But, hey, that's really not inconsistent with real life -- hardcore science is not as mainstream as it ought to be. Cripes, just look at the Great Christian Contrivance called "Intelligent Design". Anyone who knows what science actually is would know that "ID" (or, perhaps, a "less devious prior incarnation of the concept it encompasses") belongs in the philosophy and theology classrooms. But I disgress. A lot.

Back to the point! Do any of you remember my deranged babbling in the vein of, "I don't think we understand the soul-body relationship yet! There's something we're missing!!"? Well, I think my persistence is finally paying off. (It's actually rather amusing what inspired the first big step in the right direction, but I don't think anyone especially wants to hear about Eva/Angel love-children right now...) I've stumbled upon a VERY versatile concept that has been serving my purposes -- you know, in my bizarre fantasy world of naked Evas -- on an increasingly impressive scale. And the great part is, it fits into the original work, too. As far as I can tell, anyway. A few more blessings from the Muse Serendipity (seriously, that's what it feels like), and I may finally figure out the obnoxious technicalities behind ATFs, Corporeal Integrity, and Tangification. Gawd -- wouldn't that be nice?!?

"Metaphysical biology", as I've come to find, is as complicated as it sounds, so it may take some time before everything gets sorted out. But I think my theory can accomodate everything, ultimately. It hasn't failed me yet, in the arenas where I've applied it so far. However, it is VERY difficult to explain, so it will take time. Lots of time.

And I want to present it in a somewhat more "user-friendly" manner than the drawn-out "exercises in intellectual madness"/"experiments in processional logic" that led to its conception in the first place. (That's my kind of turf, but probably not everyone's cup o' tea.) So, instead, what I plan to do is go over every bit in NGE that acts as a piece of this giant, horrible puzzle, and then, proof by proof, put them all together. And that, my friends, is a FSCK-TON of work right there. Obviously, with my existing obligations to FGC, the "Treatise on Metaphysical Biology" is not a priority, but an exhumation that will have to take place over many, many Moons. Remind you of anybody? :nudges Shin-seiki in the ribs some more:

Pending the actual unveiling of my discoveries, I'll do that teasing I was talking about and list some of the questions which I think I am on the brink of answering. If I haven't already. (I'm not quite sure yet. Some more playing around with fictitious technical minutiae and I'll find out soon enough.)
Just how DID Adam make those babies, after all?* And what's the deal with those kids? Why do they start off humanoid, only to reject that form? How the hell does that work? Who or what is Tabris -- really? What is the true relationship between "Tabris", "Kaworu", and Adam? Are Tabris and Kaworu really the same thing, after all, or...? If Rei is a clone of Yui, why is Rei's pigmentation different? And why does it change again when she returns to Lilith? Why does EVA-01 have green eyes? I mean, isn't that just a LEEETLE bit suspicious? (Hint: Who else has green eyes?) What's this $#1+ about Angels being "other possibilities" of human life? What the hell is the relationship between humans and Angels, anyway? And, come to think of it, what might that have to do with Gendo's claim that Adam is "the first human"? Does it have something to do with how NGE redefines what human life is? Or, for that matter, Seele's intimations that the Angels are "the true successors"...? How did Kyoko retain her form after having her soul sucked out by EVA-02? Yes, everyone LOVES this one! How do humans replicate their bodies perfectly after being reduced to no more than a disembodied soul? And from any LCL, at that: "Original Shinji Juice Not Required". WTF is happening to EVA-01, the last time we see her in the series? And does it, in fact, have something to do with the mysterious image of Yui that Shinji is greeted by in episode #16? Exactly how DOES Kaworu take control of Nigouki? How do we interpret the explanation he gave? And two other mysterious lines from Kaworu and Kozo in that sequence that I've never heard explained, too... On a related note (trust me), what does that have to do with Lilith's "assimilation" of the harpies? And, FINALLY, do you remember that crap in episode #26 about "the world of freedom" and "image"? I mean, what the flying fruitcake does that have to do with anything?!?
The answer to #11: "Probably everything". (Or, at least, the other ten items mentioned above, and some other ones that my brain hasn't gotten to.) It is a rather convoluted clue, but it helps tie ALL of these questions together. I've wondered more than once about that scene and how out-of-place it feels... But, as Shin-seiki has taught us, NGE is not a show about throwaway lines after all.

_________________________________

* Yes, yes. I am very stubborn, and part of the answer to (1) -- as a whole -- involves me, in my very stubborn way, demonstrating that we CAN take what Kaworu says at face value (since that is what the default approach to NGE should be -- RIGHT, Shin-seiki?) and that Adam being 100% female absolutely works. Two words to consider: "Planned Parenthood". I will elaborate more in time, in case nobody figures it out beforehand.

Originally posted on: 24-Dec-2005, 07:58 GMT

[Magami No ER [ANF]]

Oh yeah, love to see the connection with this. (Especially six, yer right)
I thought myself that the souls could only be visible when Eva's/SoL's were involved...quite hard to explain...so...never mind.
BUt really, this metaphysicalogy regarding souls often baffles me...
Oh, and #2 reminds me of my good ol' embryo thread....where Akira was spawned.^^;

Originally posted on: 24-Dec-2005, 18:06 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Ah, all will come into focus in time...

And you are rightfully reminded! Do you really think I have abandoned my pet theory about the "Katsuragi-Kaworu" connection? It makes way too much sense to drop. ("Akira" did come from the depths of my disturbed imagination, originally, AFAIK. What a great guy!)

Originally posted on: 24-Dec-2005, 19:55 GMT

[BLACKANGEL32076 [ANF]]

Ah, all will come into focus in time...

And you are rightfully reminded! Do you really think I have abandoned my pet theory about the "Katsuragi-Kaworu" connection? It makes way too much sense to drop. ("Akira" did come from the depths of my disturbed imagination, originally, AFAIK. What a great guy!)

Huh? What is this theory all about?

*huggles his Misato-pushie* How does this involve my Misa-chan???

Originally posted on: 26-Dec-2005, 03:46 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

http://animenation.net/forums/showthread.php?t=167003

It's at the top of the current threads list, in case it has slipped your vision... It doesn't have my name in the title (thank gawd, aren't you getting sick of those by now?), but that's where it is.

Originally posted on: 26-Dec-2005, 05:31 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Due to where inspiration has taken me, I am beginning to pen the out-and-out, fully developed essay that is required to tackle this concept. And, in doing so, I have stumbled across something in NGE that I had not fully acknowledged up until now: The way that NGE fulfills its duty, as a work of sci-fi, by providing a very real warning about the dangers of not only science, but its complement (can you guess?), to full human potential and fulfillment. It is FASCINATING. In the same way that the premise of metaphysical biology brings the technical minutiae full circle, the theme it encompasses is brought to light by the realization that the other is there.* And, ultimately, it brings the entirety of NGE itself full circle by intimately connecting to NGE's greater status as a story about life and human nature. The vehicle of the underlying themes -- that is, the NGE universe that Anno-tachi have created -- is far more critical that anyone has acknowledged (as far as I am aware).

Prepare yourselves for a shot in the face of fire hose intensity -- if your reaction to these findings is the same as mine, that is precisely what this will feel like. Likewise, prepare yourselves for the long intellectual journey that is needed to realize the truth of all this, for which I will attempt to serve as your humble guide in the days (or however long) to come.

Again, hold your thoughts (keep a running file in Notepad -- that's what I do ) until I begin. It is very important to not jump the gun until the appropriate time, which is when I have laid the amazing groundwork that has presented itself to me...

Stay tuned, people. The answer is out there, but, in this sci-fi tale, it isn't "forty-two".

----------------

* Ironically enough, this should give me an opportunity -- which I will only take in a friendly nudge-in-the-side fashion -- to let out a deafening "TOLD YOU SO!!!" to everyone who has criticized the pursuit of NGE's supposed "insignificant details". As I continue to repeat throughout this one, giant revelation, NGE is a PUZZLE, which means ALL OF ITS PIECES FIT TOGETHER to form one coherent and solid whole. Even its so-called "insignificant details" form half of the full picture. I feel confident that the critics of my past (and present) convictions will have to face this "truth", should they care to walk the road that leads to it.

Originally posted on: 27-Dec-2005, 08:23 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Well, it looks like I answered a couple of the questions I started off with in those other thredi convoluti </phony> I started. Incidentally please ignore question #8, because, after thinking some more, I actually think it's got everything to do with Sammael's cameo and nothing to do with episode #16 now, unless THOSE two end up somehow being connected. (Ergo, I've gone back to my "Sadamoto homage" theory for the weird Yui image.)

Despite the fact that my brain has essentially crashed and burned (hence the Embryo Adam avatar), I'll attempt to follow up on my promises of "sâbisu, sâbi-SU!" with my so-called "treatise", but without any promises whatsoever of grandiosity. I'll start off by rambling a bit so that my neurons know where to go next.

First off, a warning for the impatient: This issue and everything behind it (from what I have seen in my own meanderings, anyway) is, as I have said, incredibly complicated. Something as "simple" as the metabiology of souls ultimately ties into one of NGE's much deeper themes — and the purpose it ultimately services in the story. (And, no, these concepts do not change the core purpose of the story in any way whatsoever, only throw them into greater focus.) If you lack patience when it comes to seeking intellectual "truth", this is NOT the thread for you. This relates the puzzle of NGE and the relationship its followers form with it: Much like a relationship with another person (or various other things), the more you invest, the more you will get back. Those not willing to invest never achieve the full potential outcome. Any one person's willingness in this area is "correct" for that person, but this thread is for those people who share my own persistence and dedication.

Another warning for any intending in reading this: The concept of metaphysical biology, and the (IMHO) critical things which have led to my intellectual pursuit of it in the first place, fits into my own personal and intellectual relationship with the opposing, but intimately connected, forces of religion and science. If this is a sensitive area for you, and you are inclined to be angered or frustrated by viewpoints you do not share, please do not proceed.

Thank you.

First off, consider the "world view" of NGE. This is a world that is as like our own world (or the mid-90's equivalent thereof, anyway) as it is different. Giant extraterrestrial humans sleeping beneath Hakone and Antarctica aside, might there be a fundamental logic behind this? Let's take a brief walk through human development, and at which point the Real World and the NGE World diverge, since I think of this as a way of mentally establishing the groundwork of all to follow. (While giving me an excuse to exercise my brain a little.)

In real life, we have science, and we have religion. In NGE terms, these might both be considered manifestations of the Fruit of Knowledge. Before the former existed, the latter was used (okay, still is, in some cases...) by a very vulnerable species to explain the workings of their world in a way that provided psychic comfort: prominently, via the archetype of supernatural "über-humans", or human-like personifications, working behind the scenes. Examples are natural phenomena, like weather, the seasons, and the cycle of the sun and the moon, along with things like disease and death.

However, as our knowledge grew, science -- which one might fundamentally define as a means of explaining the world through direct observation and logic, rather than via the supernatural -- began to "take over" the realm of religion in this regard. But, from the viewpoint of an inherently vulnerable species, this wasn't entirely a bad thing. Bringing the world down to "our level", aside from explaining the previously explainable, also put raw power into our hands and allowed us to, via increasingly complicated and impressive technologies, manipulate these natural forces for our own "benefit". Granted, various organized religions continue to reject very specific aspects of this expanded understanding in favor of explanations hailing from more ignorant times (for reasons that will never become clear to yours truly), but that doesn't stop the expansion of our knowledge and the resultant technological applications that affect believer and nonbeliever alike.

Even so, one of the areas where religion can still claim to have the "edge" is wherever science has not (yet, anyway) encroached. Perhaps one of the most glaring examples of a domain currently beyond science's reach is what we could think of as the "spiritual world", an idea that affects (most) humans on a fundamental level. That is, that nagging suspicion, or outright belief, that there is something "greater", transcending the physical or what we can touch, observe, measure, and manipulate: something that we can't see, only feel on some über-physical level, and which the workings of grey matter and neurons cannot seem to take into account.

Some religious institutions (the intellectual antagonists of my existence) use the frontier untouched by scientific understanding as an excuse to brand such things forever beyond its reach, which is something NO ONE has the right to claim. The limits of human understanding should never be used as a reason to embrace ignorance: "the workings of <insert> are inherently beyond our understanding, so let's just forget about trying", and thus the tenets of some institution must be accepted unflinchingly. Incidentally, this is one of my fundamental criticisms of much religion — establishing parameters for the rather more intangible and abstract aspects of life (values, and such) is one thing, and recognizing where we have made advances in the understanding of our world is entirely another, with absolutely no relevance to the former. Honestly, what do evolution and Earth's ovular nature have to do with being a good person and finding value in life? Absolutely nothing.

Scientists will be the first to admit that we do not understand everything. That's kind of why science exists in the first place, to pursue the expansion of our own knowledge. Of course, these as-yet-not-understood (but not necessarily inherently understandable) phenomena are all around us, and they certainly include items that tie into the reasons why people believe in the concept of such things as souls -- for example, young children having memories that they by all rights shouldn't. The possibility exists that the chasm between science and religion will further shrink if something previously-elusive finally comes to light.

And this intriguing possibility is one explored by science fiction — including NGE.

It's no secret that NGE liberally mixes science (or pseudo-science, anyway) with concepts that are beyond true science's reach, depicting abstract concepts from psychology (e.g., destrudo and libido) and from religion (souls) as things that can be measured, manipulated, even seen. In this world, the gap between the observable and the unobservable has been bridged and unified under the banner of actual science, with some rather intriguing ramifications for this fictional world.

Well, there is something to set the foundation. (As I said, principally for my own benefit, heh.) Hopefully, that was interesting to some extent and I'm not completely boring you. Reichu doesn't want to be boring.

I'll come back a little later to get the real party started.

Originally posted on: 31-Dec-2005, 17:33 GMT

[Arkard [ANF]]

That was not only entertaining, but impressive. Here's waiting for the party to start.

On a side note, I mostly agree with you on this topic. I came to a feeling of utter rejection towards religion for a part of my life, but with time I've come to accept it as a means to establish a number of social values and help certain kinds of people grow a sense of self-worth they couldn't achieve any other way. I still don't like the kind of religious people that take a negative stance at progress because of their fear of losing their self-justifications. (I don't mean to offend anybody, please, don't take it like that).

It is also obvious that the world of NGE is a world where the depths of science and religion have already become much closer than they're in real world.

Thanks and keep it up, I'm diggin' this stuff. ;P

Originally posted on: 31-Dec-2005, 19:18 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Groovy, baby!

For my part, I've never had a "use" for religion. My folks took the sibs and I to a unitarian fellowship when we were young so that we could be exposed to a number of different faiths, but none of us felt a need to "follow up". We were fine the way we were, so I've spun together my moral fibres without supernatural aid. Doesn't mean that I have anything against those who do have a use for religion in general, although I feel antagonistic towards whatever subsets use their faiths as an excuse to be ignorant, racist, sexist, etc.

But that's not the point of this thread, so ya'll make sure we don't get TOO far off track.

In any case, now that Reichu has had her nap, it's time to scavenge the show for some highlights. Yay!

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 08:21 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Well, okay... If I try scavenging the series, everyone will be waiting until the end of time. So, I'll take the lazy way out and just lay the theoretical groundwork. We can see where to go from there.

NGE doesn't draw any attention to its unusual version of science. It just is, and the audience is supposed to suspend their disbelief. Even so, they do throw one little hint your way about what's actually going on: The sign to Fuyutsuki's office at Kyoko University reveals that he's part of the "Department of Metaphysical Biology". WTF kind of campus is this?

I can't find anything digestible about my brain which sheds light on what on Earth MPB is supposed to be, so we'll simply approach it as it stands. The most useful definition of "metaphysical", here, seems to be "immaterial" or "incorporeal". And "biology" is, well, the study of life. The implication, I think, is of an incorporeal aspect of life -- life energies, if you will. The biology of what transcends the physical.

As I mentioned earlier, humans have suspected the existence of an incorporeal aspect of life for about as long as humans have existed. Part of it has to do with the fear of death, motivating the hope that existence does not simply end with the body, but perhaps there is more to it than that. I'm noncommittal on the issue myself, but it's certainly interesting theoretical territory. If we did discover this long-elusive essence, what would the ramifications for science be?

In NGE, there are two components required for true life: the physical and the metaphysical. The implications are of a symbiotic relationship between the two: Without life energy, matter remains dead, and the primordial soup that Lilith bestowed upon the Earth would have remained simply that. But without physical matter, and the biological components that can be built from it into a complete and functional organism, life energy is merely energy, simply essence, with no way of interacting with the physical environment. When the two come together, life is produced.

Exactly how this works is something only Fuyutsuki-sensei knows, but it gives us something to work from in terms of making SOME sense of the show's underlying logic.

Fascinated by the basic premise which NGE laid forward, I began to explore these concepts in fuller detail in my fan-spinoff-from-hell, BES. As I've noted elsewhere, this was initially just for my own intellectual amusement, and I was surprised to come back and find that the theories were applicable to the original, as well. The question remains if there is ample justification in the anime itself for them, so that's something for you to decide yourselves.

According to this premise, the soul, like an organism, has different parts, and it is capable of growth. (How a new lifeform receives a soul, or what happens to the soul after death, are places I won't go right now.) This concept is inspired in part by Judaism, wherein the triad of nephesh-ruwach-neshamah forms the basis of human essence. Now, while I've corrupted their own terms for my purposes in BES, we'll stick to English here. According to my own basic scheme, the three fundamentals are the core essence, mind, and image.

Essence is the part that doesn't really change: It is the basic substrate upon which all else is built. Every lifeform has this, no matter how basic. Taking its metabiological nature into account, it could possibly be considered capable of evolving, increasing in complexity along with the organism that houses it. (That would seem to require that essence is passed along with genes to offspring, which I'm still up in the air about.) Just food for thought, anyway.

Mind is what grows during the life of the organism, and it encompasses many things, such as personality, memories, and everything else unique to a particular individual. It is the sum of everything acquired through the process of living.

Image is something that I'm still playing with. It could be considered the "physical" aspect of the soul, the part most intimately connected to the body. Image radiates, via the ATF, through every cell of the body and maintains a very concise record of not only basic genetic structure, but environmental influences, as well. It is because of image that a person can be reduced to LCL and subsequently return in a carbon copy body — image remembers and it autonomically reassembles, from scratch or otherwise, the biological components in exacting detail. And THAT is damn impressive.

If you are not restricted to an inflexible meatsack, as are the Lilim of the show, image becomes considerably more versatile. What the Lilim possess could be considered Native Image, or the image that is limited by natural forces. The Adanoko ("Angels") possess this, as well: Their inherent state is that of a humanoid being, almost certainly of the Adam/Eva vein (considering who they were born from), confirmed genetically with Shamshel and visually with Sandalphon. However, they are capable, upon Quickening*, of transcending their genetics and assuming a form limited only by the human imagination. This, and any other body image not grounded genetically, I refer to as Derived Image — the exact workings of which even I am helpless to offer up a convoluted explanation.

That gives you a little something to mull over. I'll try to remember the more "advanced applications" later. It makes some kind of convoluted sense in my brain, but putting it into terms meant to be understood by anyone but myself is harder than I thought. Watch as all of the hype crumbles into dust! But, hey, even if it does, MPB is still something we can play around with until we get something that works.

* Capitalization optional. I fabricated this term for BES (in a story about uber-Lilim Angels, trust me, you need it) in reference to the Angel "maturation process", witnessed in Sandalphon: the metamorphosis into a chosen form, followed immediately by hatching. To begin that process is "to quicken".

Originally posted on: 31-Dec-2005, 23:14 GMT

[Arkard [ANF]]

It actually does make sense, so far.

I've got a question, though, you consider the option of essence of a being evolving, but, wouldn't that imply a change in the nature of that being? I guess a small change over generations would explain the concept of species' evolution if so.

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 00:00 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Well, since the physical and metaphysical elements are symbiotic, I suppose one could think of them both co-evolving. A more complicated organism provides increased scope for increasingly complicated metabiological processes -- since, you know, what's the point of a soul having some capacity that can't be expressed by the physical aspect?

The Fruit of Knowledge is, I suspect, a metabiological component that can be accomodated by the human essence. Even though Adam & Family may not innately possess it -- on purpose -- there is probably some way for them to acquire it (although the show never goes into that terrain), due to the fact that they, by their very nature as "human", must have the same underlying essence as ourselves. (Maybe they can get it at college or something. )

As I mentioned elsewhere, I suspect that Terran life was somehow being "guided" to produce a species that could accomodate the FoK -- although what forces guided us there, and how we got it once we were there, is completely beyond me.

Where's Professor Fuyutsuki when you need him?

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 00:47 GMT

[CrossboneGundam [ANF]]

So, I've thought of a pretty easy solution to these problems with Evangelion: Don't think too much about it. Somehow, I wouldn't be surprised if Hideaki Anno never even pondered or thought out these sorts of minute details.

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 01:15 GMT

[Arkard [ANF]]

Wow. I bet none of the people that come here daily or almost daily and write 20000+ words essays about a particular thing in Evangelion ever thought about that possibility.

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 01:50 GMT

[BLACKANGEL32076 [ANF]]

If Fuyutsuki is the head of “The Study of Life Energy” Department of Kyoto U, this guy must have been a serious intellectual top gun. If that is the case and Yui was his student, how did she get mixed up with Gendo?

…or is Gendo more of a genius in his own right than I give him credit for?

[quote] In NGE, there are two components required for true life: the physical and the metaphysical. The implications are of a symbiotic relationship between the two: Without life energy, matter remains dead, and the primordial soup that Lilith bestowed upon the Earth would have remained simply that. But without physical matter, and the biological components that can be built from it into a complete and functional organism, life energy is merely energy, simply essence, with no way of interacting with the physical environment. When the two come together, life is produced. [\quote]

This sounds like a very Shinto/Taoist definition of the nature of souls/spirits/ghosts/”gods”. No surprise that a story like this came from the culture/society that it did.

One more thing:
If the study of “Life Energy” does one day pan out and we are able to scientifically gauge the human soul, I don't see it as being in any way a detriment to science at all. On the contrary, if science could be used to legitimize religious beliefs by being able to scientifically measure the tenets of a given religion, what a boon to both as both sides of the argument could come to some sort of common ground and together, better lead humanity to a brighter future that the one current “futurists” have already forecast. It is HERE, that humanity will see its evolutionary “jump start” and we will see humanity take its own place in the stars, both literally and figuratively!

Originally posted on: 02-Jan-2006, 08:06 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Well, I think it might shed light on just why they wanted Fuyutsuki on the team... I wonder if it was the combination of his own profession, and Yui's bioengineering background, that led to the Evas finally being realized. (I think I might have made jokes in that vein before...)

I still wonder what on Earth the G-man's background is in. He and his buddy Old Man Keel didn't think too highly of Katsuragi and the others, so he's clearly not a scientist. This one will probably bother me to the end of the my days...

Of course it won't be a DETRIMENT to science, but it's hard to say what the consequences might be for us. We can see in NGE what happens when you put that kind of power into the hands of religious zealots like Seele, and it's not pretty.

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 22:43 GMT

[Shin-seiki [ANF]]

I still wonder what on Earth the G-man's background is in. He and his buddy Old Man Keel didn't think too highly of Katsuragi and the others, so he's clearly not a scientist. This one will probably bother me to the end of the my days...

I dunno that that necesarily follows; Gendo is a student at Kyoto U just like Yui, and gets Fuytsuki designated as his advisor. Also, it occurs to me that Gendo may just be engaging in a bit of toad-eating to ingratiate himself with Keel in the pre-2I scene.

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 23:18 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Hmm. Maybe he's one of Keel's archaeology/theology students. That might explain an awful lot. I'm sure Keel's eye was caught by Gendo's ravishing good looks, as we-- er, I'd better stop that one right there. But, yeah, maybe a plausible possibility?

(Incidentally, I can't find a definition for "toad-eating" in any of the obvious places.)

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 23:24 GMT

[Shin-seiki [ANF]]

Hmm. Maybe he's one of Keel's archaeology/theology students. That might explain an awful lot. I'm sure Keel's eye was caught by Gendo's ravishing good looks, as we-- er, I'd better stop that one right there. But, yeah, maybe a plausible possibility?

(Incidentally, I can't find a definition for "toad-eating" in any of the obvious places.)

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=toadying
A very vivid little idiom, IMHO...

Originally posted on: 01-Jan-2006, 23:27 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Oh... I see what you mean. Gendo clearly doesn't share Keel's thoughts on scientists, namely because of who he's married to. Reichu can be a little slow sometimes.

BUT WHAT THE HELL DOES GENDO DO?!?

To nudge this thing into more productive directions, one of the theoretical terrains I was attempting to cover was how MPB might account for instances (which I believe exist...) of the Lilim body maintaining integrity without the help of the soul. My take is that the ATF, present before birth, is -- as with life emerging from the primordial ooze -- the "binding agent" (or <insert>) that allows the organic matter required for life to take on a form capable of supporting it. The scaffolding, if you will. Once the structure is in place, however, the ATF is no longer NECESSARY to hold it together. In fact, image will continue to emanate through the biomass once associated with that ATF* unless forcibly disintegrated by something (destrudo? AATF? not sure yet).

We see this "binding property" in work in various places throughout the show. The most blatant and infamous one is, of course, Psycho-Kyoko. There is no doubt in my mind that she is very much the victim of soul suckage, and, without the soul, her psychological processes are unravelling at warp speed. Destrudo may not manifest in a way that causes auto-Tangification (still wonder how THAT works), but the husk will take the first train out that presents itself, being pretty much the living dead as it is.

Another time we see this property in effect is in EoE with severed bodies. I don't think that souls of anyone other than a weirdo like Lilith possess the Multiplicitous Property of Being Anytime, Anywhere. I b'lieve that, in Lilim, the soul seems to wander the body freely, but it has a default resting place where it prefers to not be nudged from. And, incidentally, I think this is the key to finally explaining just WHAT happens to ol' Gen-chan. (Those who have already heard me rant to myself on the matter -- stay quiet, you.)

Yes, you have to wait a little. GAH HAH HAHHHHH!!!

* This actually does have at least one advanced application not restricted to my private fantasy world. :p Wait until I tell you before you stone me.

Originally posted on: 02-Jan-2006, 04:50 GMT