Reichu's Revelations: Rei, Kaworu, and Everything in Between

[Reichu [ANF]]

EDIT/DISCLAIMER: I was in a psychologically bizarre place when I began this thread, so I sound kind of like a rotten, egotistic Arschloch in places. Be assured that I was put on new medications as soon as the holidays were over, and Reichu was swiftly returned to her more typical self. Keep this in mind for the initial stages of the thread, and please forgive my unpredictable neurochemistry. Thank you.

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People, as you might have noticed, I have been making a LOT of findings lately. This post will give you inklings about some of the Latest and Greatest (part of the Muses' Christmas Eve present to me). The exhaustive details, as it goes, can only be realized as a fruit of FGC. But, I guess, that is ultimately the point of FGC anyway: To tie everything together. Make no mistake about that. None of these Revelations are mine alone. I'm just the librarian and the seamstress who, whether she likes it or not (I've gotten myself in far too deep to avoid my fate now), gets to put the large chunks of the puzzle together. It's nothing I could ever accomplish without the ideas we've been building and sharing all this time. And, when the time comes, I'll let the rest of you put the last few pieces in...

The flurry of thoughts have led to some rather chaotic thread creation on my part, so I'll ask poor Sharp-kun to tidy things up later...

This won't be exhaustive, but it will give you an idea, at least. Some things ought to be, or, at least, become clear as you read. Others will be mere teasers of much greater things to come.

I'll start by addressing this.

Rei IS NOT Shinji'S MOM. SHE IS NOT A CLONE OF Shinji'S MOM. SHE MAY EVEN HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH Shinji'S MOM.

Having said that, Rei and Shinji totally did it in the movie. That scene was the moment of vindication for all R/S fans.

Actually, that scene represents something completely different from the impression that most people will take away. And, ol' Fuzzy, while I'm not surprised that you haven't abandoned your pet theory yet, you will NOT understand this show so long as you cling to it. This is a veritable fact, if you listen to what I -- and the rest of us -- have to say.

Watch the series, note what you are shown -- not what you THINK, what you are SHOWN -- and maybe things will come into greater clarity. Part of understanding NGE is throwing aside your preconceptions and trusting that Anno-tachi are not misleading you. Some of the characters might be, but the story itself is not. Anno himself has told us that NGE is a puzzle that anyone can figure out, and he was absolutely right. If Shin-seiki has taught us anything, this is one of the most CRUCIAL points: Take everything at face value unless given adequate reason to consider "other options". This is a VITAL, no, REQUIRED tool for understanding this outstandingly honest and genuine story.

The concept of S+R is absolutely not the intention of the narrative: Rei represents a Mother. A mother to Shinji in two different ways: Through Yui, and through Lilith. The sexual tension between the two is to be expected -- this is human nature, a big thing in a show about human nature -- but it is not the point.

Shinji tells Rei that she seems like a mother, in #15, for a reason. This is immediately followed up on in #16, when Shinji finally "meets" Yui again for the first time in a while. (Yeah, she's been there for him since episode #01, but part of being an Eva pilot without the soul of an alien is being more than a little "slow". But then, we are given more information than the Children, so we really can't blame Shin-chan.) Yui tells him, "Sou, yokatta wa ne." Strangely enough, when he wakes up in the hospital, Rei says the exact same thing. Note his reaction.

Shinji is NOT an idiot. He is actually very perceptive, for all of his flaws. Behind the scenes, he has been making the connections -- both for his own benefit and that of the audience. Even though episode #16 sneaks in a big giveaway by providing an actual photo of Yui in her somewhat less metaphysical manifestation. "Gee, Shinji's mom looks kind of familiar, now that I bother to look..."

But NGE is a show that, due to its economical nature (whether intended or made necessary by the circumstances of its production; maybe a little of both), is rather cruel and it only feeds the audience the stuff they need to know in extraordinarily meager bits. They make you wait allll the way until #21 before Naoko basically spells it out for you. "Gee, I've never seen this weird kid before, but she looks kind of familiar-- Oh, $#1+!!!"

Remember, Fuzzy, Naoko is not a moron, either. Again, for all of her personal issues, she is a certifiable genius. Unless you manage to make three MAGI supercomputers, you have no right to disagree. That said, the characters in any story are a way to relate what the audience needs to know. Is it an accident that Naoko says this? No. Nor is it an accident that her infuriated mind, again, associated Rei with Yui, even though Yui isn't the type to stand there and call someone a worthless old hag over and over again. (In fact, when all is said and done, Yui is such a ludicrously generous personality that she probably gives Gendo far more than he deserves. He doesn't get EXACTLY what he wants, but Yui does the best she can given the circumstances. She's a saint, after all.)

Yui and Rei aren't the same person, but they are inseparably intertwined by the threads of fate. (Well... Yui staged most of that "fate" -- but, then, they say you ultimately determine your own, don't they?) Here is a test for you, Fuzzy-kun. Provide a basic thematic definition for each of the names below. I've given you two of the answers, and big, sopping wet hints for the other two.

Rei: Hint: She has something to do with Yui.
YUI: Soul of EVA-01
EVA-01: Surrogate daughter of Lilith
LILITH: Hint: The answer is in the third line above this one.

This test is sort of like the "challenges" they give the contestants in "CELEBRITY JEOPARDY". An example of the answers that show gives: "This color ends in 'urple'." No, the question is NOT, "What is light urple?".

In the end, what we get is just TOO neat to be an accident. This is because, in NGE, nothing happens by accident. For something that was made on a shoestring budget and under rather ardous circumstances, it is more airtight than most people acknowledge.

Back to the original point, and the stuff that probably hasn't become obvious to most people. (I sure as hell didn't really know it until today!!) The relationship between Yui and Shinji is in part based on the mother motif. But it also has to do with the nature of Rei and Lilith.

Much of NGE, and connecting all of the dots (like, say, sequences amounting to no more than a couple of minutes that are CRUCIAL for understanding the story in full), relies upon the concepts of parallelism, opposition, complementation. (The last one sounds especially fitting. )

What is Rei, outside of her connection to Yui? The complement of Kaworu.

What do Rei and Kaworu represent? The "human" manifestations of the Sources of Life: Lilith and Adam. Kaworu flat-out tells us this in his rather ... efficient interchange with Rei.

Kaworu:
So you're the First Children?
Ayanami Rei.
You're the same as me.
We've both taken the Lilim's form as our body to live on this planet.

Rei:
Who are you?

Who, indeed? One thing Rei doesn't know yet: This isn't the first time she and Kaworu -- or, rather, the people they were in a "previous life" -- have met. But Kaworu really is doing her a favor. Rei isn't sure what to think of this strange guy at first; she's more than a little suspicious. This is fair: Kaworu is kind of creepy until you get to know him. (Unless you're Shinji, who seems especially susceptible to Kaworu's charm. As Adam said, "Well, yes... I do have a way with [the boys]..." ) But Rei's not a complete idiot, either, despite her own personal problems:

Rei:
Why am I here?
Why am I still alive?
For what?
For whom?
The Fifth Children.
He looks...
...something like me.
Why?

Why? Good question, Rei. I think you know the answer. It's hidden somewhere in that little red dot you carry around. But, hey, that's what Kaworu-kun intended. Despite the fact that he was shipped in by the Bad Guys, Kaworu isn't one of them. His intentions towards Rei are 100% pure. Even if dying was his ultimate mission (a topic for another day), he made sure that wasn't all he did while he was there. He likes Shinji-kun -- but he likes Rei, too, although the nature of that relationship is slightly different...


(TO BE CONTINUED IN THE NEXT POST....)

Originally posted on: 25-Dec-2005, 10:30 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

It started long long ago, in a "previous life". The show only shows us, in the most cruely obscure manner, the aftermath of these two's previous meeting, apparently billions of years after it happened. Strange as this may sound right now (give Reichu a little faith), Kaworu's former (or, one could say, true) self was privy to an act of compassion that was not written in the "Source of Life Manual". In fact -- the exact opposite.

It's only right to return one act of compassion with another, no? Because not only is Rei a good person, fundamentally -- so is Kaworu. We don't know if it's something Old Man Keel told him to do, or something he did on his own, but what happens with Rei's character after that pivotal moment at the top of the escalator is no accident. It was Kaworu's intention, 400%.

You may recall that, shortly before he gets his own "sweet death", he looks up at Rei in the rafters. They make eye contact, for one brief and crucial moment. Like Farmer Hoggett and Babe the Sheep-Pig, a silent affirmation passes between them. Kaworu has returned the favor Rei's true self once rendered upon him. And, on some level, she has an inkling of what Kaworu has been trying to tell her.

She doesn't know enough yet to return his smile -- that comes later, I imagine. (Perhaps off-screen. That's something between the two of them.) But, after stripping off her uniform for the final time and engaging in a bit of introspection in the depths of Terminal Dogma, I think she figures it out. And, BTW, it's no accident that the pool she is seen soaking in corresponds to the sephirah of Malchuth. Anno did his research, pedantic as his intentions might have been, and this was a very deliberate visual hint, however obscure it might be to those who haven't studied their Kabbalah.

Let me throw a little more into the fray before I run along. (Gawd, these sleepless nights are getting ridiculous!)

Understanding what is going on between Rei and Kaworu requires acknowledging that the two of them are complementary forces. And, likewise, their true selves are complementary by their very nature. Perhaps their creators did not intend for them to coexist, but things are not so simple between the two. The point is, what is lacking in one is made up for in the other, and that is the key.

This is not anything that they don't tell you in the show, either. Think about it. What sets Lilim and Angels apart, for all their similarities? What does one have that the other does not, and vice versa? It comes back to what their respective Mommies gave them.

Adam: Fruit of Life.
The Fruit of Life is physical. Biological. It is the Super Solenoid Organ.

Lilith: Fruit of Knowledge
The Fruit of Knowledge is spiritual. Metabiological. It is both the curse and gift of Humanity.

As it will turn out when I get my flood of awesome findings out into the open, it is Lilith's gift, too. She made good use of it, long before the lifeforms she existed to produce were ready for it. And entirely for their collective sake, as far as her objective was concerned.

Like I said, I don't think Anno-san was lying when he called his story a puzzle. The pieces fit together. To give you an example of how far this goes, think about the most annoyingly cryptic technical minutiae in NGE. Hmm... The circumstances behind 2I? That's a big one. The motivations of the Angels and the force drawing them to Hakone? Annoying as hell. Another one is, of course, large, red, and a source of Major Owies if you happen to be a descendant of Adam. (Note: I just gave you a very big clue in that last sentence.)

The Spear of Longinus? You got it. (Although I am on the way towards tackling those other two mysteries, too.) While I haven't figured it out COMPLETELY yet -- there are still some things I need to work out, in light of very accomodating realizations -- I am pretty sure I am on the track that will lead to the pay-off we've all been waiting for.

Why am I mentioning the Spear of Longinus if I'm talking about the two "Fruits"? Because the Spear has everything to do with both, in a sense. Do you guys remember the old idea about the Spear being another form of the Super Solenoid? Okay, it wasn't completely right... but, as it turns out, it wasn't completely wrong, either. It was HALF right.


(TO BE CONTINUED IN THE NEXT POST...)

Originally posted on: 25-Dec-2005, 10:58 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Another major contribution to my realizations is Shin-seiki's pet theory about how Adam ended up skewered on that Spear. I wasn't sure at first, Scotty-boy, but, as it turns out, you ended up being ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!!! :gives Shin-seiki a pat on the back for the 500th time -- and certainly not the last: But there is one part of that story that, AFAIK, you hadn't encountered. If you've been following this closely, maybe you'll be able to figure it out before everybody else.

The nature of the Spear is revealed to us in #26'. Part of this is through Yui and what we see her do with it. Some examples:

(1) Summon it from the Moon.

Dispel ALL of your doubts here, folks. I finally found the proofs for this one that I was missing before.

Don't believe me? Pay attention to what Yui does as soon as she Ascends. What are the first things she does? Pop the movie in and see for yourself. Pay attention. And then, when you see the shot of the Spear stuck in the Moon, pay even closer attention. What happens when the "magnet effect" manifests? Hey... isn't that strange distortion something that we've seen in the show many, many times before?!?

Then, after it comes zooming down to Earth, take a look at Yui. Does she recoil in surprise? The exact opposite. While I'm not sure why the point of the Spear hovers at her throat, the fact that the Spear follows her around while the harpies turn her into the Big Purple Messiah in the Sky is rather revealing. Isn't there another time we see the Spear following her around without her needing to physically contact it...?

(2) Merge with it to form the Tree of Life.

Although it may not be obvious, this is a very deliberate act. Yui ACCOMODATES the Spear with her most precious part. Most of the time, the relationship between the Spear and a core is somewhat less friendly.

Also, pay attention to Kozo's rather cryptic comments about the Tree of Life. Just what the hell is that thing, anyway? I'm still working on that one, but I finally realized that he isn't completely babbling nonsense. I think it has a lot to do with the hint we're dropped in NGE2, too:

S2 unit is the "base" of god, and Evas are the "body" of god. Once the human souls are merged into them both, and our "last natural enemy", the fail safe device Longinus spear is destroyed, nothing then can stop the process of the complementation.

Although, like I said... I haven't quite accomodated all of that yet. I think it may be fair to say that the proper translation would be EVA, singular... because there is only one, that I can tell, who seems to have the kind of link with the Spear that is mentioned in the above tidbit.

(3) Barf the Spear up after escaping GNR.

You think about this one yourselves. It's VERY revealing.

(4) Use the Spear to end Instrumentality -- and then hot-foot it off Earth with the Spear in tow.

This is just as revealing. If part of what Yui does to dissolve HIP is petrify all divinities and destroy the clones of the Spear (because that's what they are), why on Earth would she take the original with her? Why, indeed...?

EVA + SPEAR = "Tree of Life"

Just what does Kozo say the Tree of Life is? (I'm going to check bb's translation here. Stay tuned.) Does this have something to do with where Yui is going and what her future career is going to be?


And the final clue I'm going to throw at you kids is this... something we've noticed a few times but could never quite comprehend. Again, visual motifs being used as a big nudge in the side...



Two visual motifs. Notice them well.

There is one thing I haven't gotten to, that ties all of this crap back into the Fuzzy Comment that started this tidal wave. But I can do that after I get some MUUUUUUCH needed sleep.

Originally posted on: 25-Dec-2005, 11:20 GMT

[OMF [ANF]]

Just what does Kozo say the Tree of Life is? (I'm going to check bb's translation here. Stay tuned.) Does this have something to do with where Yui is going and what her future career is going to be?

"The Propagule Of Souls" was I believe Bochan Bird's translation of Fuyutsuki's line.

Propagule:
"Any of various usually vegetative portions of a plant, such as a bud or other offshoot, that aid in dispersal of the species and from which a new individual may develop."

An offshoot, seed, or "cutting" of souls, from the Tree of Life? To be "planted" elsewhere? Is this where your surge of inspiration is taking you?

Originally posted on: 26-Dec-2005, 01:22 GMT

[AchtungAffen [ANF]]

I've heard of a theory of soul division in which humans (in Eva) when reproducing they're "dividing" their soul and passing some one part to the offspring. The theory affirms of a process of division which starts when Lilith creates humanity by "dividing" her own soul.

This propagule seems to run on those lines too, right?

Originally posted on: 26-Dec-2005, 02:37 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Interesting... If you guys are barking up the right tree (GAH HAH HAHHHH!!!), this rather neatly explains the premise in NGE wherein artificially-created lifeforms must have a soul salvaged in from someone else...

But incidentally, this concept is not extremely different from one of the fundamental premises of MPB that I have yet to unveil, the "missing piece" that we've been overlooking all this time despite the fact that it's been right in front of our eyes. It's EERILY similar, to the point where the two concepts will almost certainly make contact of a very big kind. :chill runs down spine:

I have to think about all of this a lot more. But in the end, it will all tie together. And hopefully that "end" isn't very far off.

In any case, hold onto those thoughts. The soul stuff belongs in Part 3. Here, I was primarily iinterested in tying together these threads: Rei & Kaworu, Adam-Lilith-Shogouki, and FoL-FoK-Spear.

:waits for people to play into her "What is the Spear?" game:

Originally posted on: 26-Dec-2005, 05:36 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Well, pfft, you people are no fun at all. ;P

That pending, let me share a couple of items about Yui's Ultimate Destiny and how it involves, like some other things in this deluge, an underlying cackle of "TOLD YOU SO!!!". But I am far too excited by all of this to be bitter in the least. "Revenge, as they say, is a sucker's game."

The first hint: My abiding, stalwart insistence that EVA-01 is a "bridge entity" between Adam and Lilith is a premise without which the show, and Yui's fate, will never make any sense.

The following is a bit I dropped over here originally, but realized in retrospect that it was in the wrong thread. Yui has everything to do with what is being discussed here, and the other thread is best reserved for a different set of ideas:

I've finally realized the truth behind EVA-01's final appearance (that's two definitions of "appearance" there). Hint: It involves the pay-off for the image of Sammael that has eluded me for so long, and Shin-seiki's observations here form the basic building blocks. Scott, you completely underestimated the importance of the final item, since it serves, when all is said and done, as the icing that completes the cake… Not only are there no throwaway lines in this show, there are no throwaway visual motifs, either.

To start you off: What does Sammael represent? And I mean on the most basic level. Wherever Sammael ended up, according to his mythological legacy, is (IMO) completely unimportant in a show where the polar concepts of "good" and "evil" do not exist.

And my follow-up to that, which is new:

I've been pleasantly surprised to realize that my own quirky "ideals" are not necessarily incompatible with Yui's "final appearance" after all. This has much to do with complaints I have made about claims that Shogouki has somehow "become Yui" at the end -- which are, as I will hopefully demonstrate when all is said and done, rather unfounded when considering that all this assumption is based upon is a head of "flaming hair": The significance of which has only made itself clear to me today.

This is as opposed to what I consider the more logical assessment, which is that, as with the other examples of Salvaging that we have seen in the show, a soul leaves (or is forcibly taken from...) its original body for a new vessel, where it is shaped into something slightly different. To provide a metaphor, Flavored water can be frozen into differently-shaped popsicles depending on which plastic mold you select, but this shape is not permanent, as it can be changed simply by "priming" the content and transferring it, unchanged on the fundamental level, to the new mold. The same holds true for the principles of metaphysical biology.

Yui's soul has willfully abandoned its original container for her "customized God-human body", and, as a result, they fuse to create something that neither could be alone. The new entity birthed (oh dear, it's the "I'm my own Mama" Syndrome, again!) will, by the time Yui's work reaches its apex, far transcend its individual parts — and either of its original sources.

To continue my efforts at knocking an IMO unfounded theory off the edge of the proverbial cliff, think about it: "Yui—>Shogouki—>Yui". This is extremely nonintuitive, and it casts heavy dissonance when we consider the respective "evolutions" of Adam and Lilith, via their "metamorphoses" into Kaworu and Rei. By making Yui an "exception", rather than acknowledging that her own journey is the Complement of her Parents' (you try to figure it out ), the pieces cannot fit. With the realization about the significance of Sammael's image, there remains no reason why we should assume that any "retro-evolution" (that is, Yui making a U-turn back to her own Primitive State) has occurred. She has simply made the next, and possibly final, step in her own Divine Evolution.

This ought to make for an interesting artwork...

Now, if you kids decide to make some passes at this very large, red, two-pronged carrot that Professor Clarkenstein is dangling in front of your noses, this thread could be a bit less agonizing for everybody. But… I can wait. Can you?

GAH HAH HAH HAHHHHH!!!

Originally posted on: 27-Dec-2005, 03:20 GMT

[Mr. Tines [ANF]]

From your current "Location", I see that I have indeed managed to be a corruptive influence

Well, pfft, you people are no fun at all. ;P

I can only answer for myself, I'm afraid, but the Longinus no yari is not something I have deeply pondered. Burdened with my own preconceptions, I have looked on it as an accident (as opposed to essence) of this instance of the Transcendence scenario.

As a consequence, I'm probably at least two "Aha!" moments behind where I'd need to be to integrate the gestalt of the NGE monomyth.

Originally posted on: 27-Dec-2005, 20:36 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

From your current "Location", I see that I have indeed managed to be a corruptive influence

It seemed eerily appropriate, after I changed my custom title to my latest "nickname" (which I think I'm rather fond of; I encourage everyone else to employ it ). Indeed, on multiple levels...

I can only answer for myself, I'm afraid, but the Longinus no yari is not something I have deeply pondered. Burdened with my own preconceptions, I have looked on it as an accident (as opposed to essence) of this instance of the Transcendence scenario.

Perhaps it would be best to start with a clean slate, Steve-ojisan. One important part of the Rosetta Stone is the edict, "To see with eyes free of preconception". Consider everything from a fresh angle, one wherein everything old is new. As you may have seen, I believe I demonstrated the reliability of this principle by "stumbling", via Kyoko, upon the secret of understanding what makes (and breaks) Asuka -- which, as I noted, was a genuinely unnerving surprise, considering that I am one of her greatest critics around here and have had a history of expressing relentless hostility towards her character…

Part of my policy with the Revelations is that I am not going to tell anyone what they should think, nor will I operate from the perspective, "If you don't believe me, you... are a fscking... moron. Thankyou. Thankyou. Thankyou.". This is because being told what to think, without being provided any reasoning whatsoever for it, is not the way one finds genuine "truth". Kaji's character in part encompasses this approach — he is not satisfied with merely watching, and he cannot be true to himself without taking things the full distance, no matter what the cost to him, so long as he can impart his knowledge to his significant other before he is reduced to a corpse lying face-down in a ditch, "making friends with the local worms". Fortunately, most of us here are not triple agents, so we are free of this risk, although we still must exercise caution in our pursuit of truth, because excess in any area is Bad. NGE is a story about life, and the principles I have brought up in this paragraph apply equally well to all aspects of life.

Back to the point, my intent is to, like Virgil, be your guide on your own NGE journey, as I retrace the steps that I have made on the unexpected, and unprecedented, trip through Intellectual Hell to which I have been subjected. (Seriously — I have not been motivated to write anything on this scale except BES in a very long time.) Although it may not be all fun and games at first, hopefully you'll reach the Light if you continue to follow me to the very end.

With the Spear, being one of the most annoying mysteries in NGE and one I am somewhat proud to have cracked (more or less), I am not intent on spoon-feeding you guys, because that just isn't any fun at all. I think the same will hold true with the others I brought up in the same context. I will attempt to guide you, and hope that at least one person accepts the hand I offer. As I said, these Revelations do NOT belong to me alone, and I think I owe it to everybody to give your own deductive skills the respect they deserve.

So, for anyone willing to "play along" so that this thread may proceed as planned, here are my instructions:
Get out your DVDs. (Or whatever.)
— Browse the show for the parts relevant to cracking the mystery of the Spear. Start simple: Restrict yourself to the Spear's appearances and direct references to it. When you encounter these, pay close attention, but don't think yet. Clear your mind, and take detailed note of exactly what you are shown, no more and no less. Also note the problems and questions that intuitively present themselves along the way.
— Attempt to fit together the pieces you have been given to the best of your ability. With persistence, at least some will cooperate.
— What you have assembled so far will give you an idea of where to look next. So proceed the whatever items your own deductions tell you are connected to the Spear. Attempt to find the simplest possible answers for your questions along the way. Lather, rinse, and repeat until you have exhausted the clues in the show and your own psychic energies.
— If necessary, take a look at what supplemental sources have to say. As a general rule, they will not tell you anything that is not in the show itself — only provide greater clarity.
— Return and consider these words:

As I am an honest duck
And we have deserved luck
Now to 'scape Sammael's fun,
We will reach success ere long;
Give me your hand, be us friends hence,
And Reichu shall guide you to sense.
Wow, that turned out better than I'd expected!

And speaking of Sammael, he, ironically, is the real reason for this policy regarding Pursuit of Truth, although I'll withhold that story unless someone requests it.

Originally posted on: 27-Dec-2005, 18:03 GMT

[Arkard [ANF]]

And speaking of Sammael, he, ironically, is the real reason for this policy regarding Pursuit of Truth, although I'll withhold that story unless someone requests it.

Damn, I do request it. XD

BTW, congrats, your work seems almost flawless to the point that I feel in some instances that I'm reading official information. I am having so much fun reading all this. And furthermore, I used to think I was "obssesed" with this series,... um, now I realize I am pretty normal. xD

Originally posted on: 27-Dec-2005, 22:16 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

I am the Messiah. I am nailed to the cross and poked with spears. The blood and tears I emit are your Revelations. I suffer inexorably so that everyone else can have a life.



Okay, it does contain a grain of truth. Do you want to know how much sleep I have gotten in the past week+? It's a truth as horrible as the thought of this German geezer and a beautiful Japanese man... er... ...which, thankfully, occured completely behind the scenes...

Arkard, do you know anything about my version of Sammael? The story about how I "discovered" his character for myself, and what I learned from him (strange as that sounds), would be pretty weird if you have no former acquaintance.

Originally posted on: 27-Dec-2005, 23:52 GMT

[Arkard [ANF]]

Unfortunately I don't know, as I am a noob around, but if I there's something that I have, is the will to hear about it. XD

So please, shoot, tell me, or post a link or.. well, do something ;P I have nothing to do and I am reading and absorbing the contents of this forum as fast as I can.

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 00:04 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Unfortunately I don't know, as I am a noob around, but if I there's something that I have, is the will to hear about it. XD

So please, shoot, tell me, or post a link or.. well, do something ;P I have nothing to do and I am reading and absorbing the contents of this forum as fast as I can.

Well, okay. Since I have been plaguing the forum with bits of fanfiction (although I am not the other one :remembers tv33's Asuka/Fuyutsuki scenario...) in my time here, I suppose this would be nothing new under the sun.

<fanfiction>

The story of "Beyond Eden's Shores" extends the NGE worldview far beyond that of Earth, or even the Homeworld of Lilith (Adam has a slightly different role in this take). One problem that is never tackled in NGE, as far as I can tell thusfar, is where metabiological energies originally came from. Using this concept, I decided the explore the possibilities of "Earths Beyond Earth", inspired in part by the relevant Judaic concepts (Heled, Tebel, etc.). In addition, I also thought that, like Adam's Children exploring "other possibilities of human life", I would explore other possibilities of where humanity's (NGE definition of human) own aspirations might possibly have taken it.

In the completely wrong order, Sammael came into play. (You can see more about him here and, even better, here.) I decided to paint my own picture of Sammael by combining the popular folklore (angel fallen from Heaven because he screwed up, doomed to forever dwell in Hell, blah blah blah) with my own sense of twisted irony. Sammael ends up representing a being who traverses the planes of existence separating Heled (our universe) from an oasis of life in the Sea of Nothing, Ayin, called Eden. His backstory is long, complicated, and even a bit sad, and what happens to him once he falls to the primordial Earth and encounters Lilith results in just as much toil and suffering. The thing I love about his character is that I have borrowed from the original Sammael's story to create one that feels much more human, with many layers of irony, but his full story is a tale that will be unveiled with BES itself.

To the point. In developing his character, I "drew from everywhere", and one unexpected source was the short story "Young Goodman Brown". In it, the "Good Christian" townspeople were actually devil worshippers when the Sun went down. But the depiction of the Devil himself is very interesting, because he is the only one in the story shown as having any integrity whatsoever. This fascinated me, and so I decided to make my Sammael somebody who never, ever told a lie.

Even so, experience has conditioned him to speak in vagueries, because he has learned that sharing the full breadth of his knowledge with anyone else is pointless. No one will believe his every word unless they stumble upon these "truths" — which he has discovered himself, through his own unending efforts — on their own. So, all that he does, frustrating as it can be, is drop all of the hints that are required. And he never says any more than what is necessary; he chooses his words very carefully.

I'm not as economic as he is, although I aspire to his level of greatness. Well, okay, not really. Like anyone else, he has his own very, very profound set of personal issues, and he knows damn well how "great" he isn't. But he is content to let those who think so wallow in their ignorance, so long as it doesn't impede him in any way.

So whenever I make references to Sammael, oftentimes I am referring to this guy who I have described here, although a somewhat less "inspirational", and perhaps even tiresome, in-joke exists, as well.

</fanfiction>

BTW, don't rush yourself too much. Or, if you must, make sure you revisit everything, since it is impossible (unless you are some kind of freak ) to absorb the full breadth of anything on the first run-through.

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 00:35 GMT

[Arkard [ANF]]

Interesting. Makes me want to read it too. XD

You could say that this is one of those cases in which the writer puts a part of him/herself in a character, and/or he ends up putting a part of the character in him/herself.

Thinking further I think I can draw some parallels too on Samael's "truth policy" (xD) and the very nature of narration in NGE, and it's cruel way of presenting the truth.

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 01:26 GMT

[Magami No ER [ANF]]

^You may enjoy Reichu's (slightly outdated from what I've seen) Raptorian Sector.
Not that that has nearly enough relevance to be on topic...
Eh. Rei. Kaworu. Everything inbetween....
I can say I'm actually looking forawrd to re-watching these relevent parts concerning(first the Spear), but then, anything concerning Kasuragi-san. XD

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 01:40 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Feel not. When the Muses take the stone mallet to my fractured braincase again, the soul of the Raptorian Sector will be transferred to its new vessel, the Garden of Tebel (a shameless reference to BES that nonetheless sounds rather nice and encompasses pretty much everything that will be on my site). Meantime, I would prefer if everyone forgot that TRS exists right now... It is the fossilized website of a young woman who has undergone at least five years of evolution since.

I can say I'm actually looking forawrd to re-watching these relevent parts concerning(first the Spear), but then, anything concerning Kasuragi-san. XD

Well, hurry your arse up! teh Reichu is waiting!

Although I suppose I have plenty of stuff to keep me busy. Such as these troubling yaoi visions that continue to plague me. Akira is one thing (if he looks the way he does in my avatar, and is characterized the way I depict him, I would probably be squealing like a schoolgirl if he were my teacher, too), but Keel is... :shudder: Well, at least I attempted to portray that aspect of Keel in a fairly sympathetic light. Still... The seduction of a handsome and brilliant young man by an old geezer with money, power, and opportunity is just wrong on so many levels, however often it might happen in real life. That's what makes the scenario so believable, IMO.

You could say that this is one of those cases in which the writer puts a part of him/herself in a character, and/or he ends up putting a part of the character in him/herself.

That's a good way of putting it. The process of "getting to know" one's own characters feels like a real human relationship at times, with all of the give and take involved. (Although in my own treatment of poor Kyoko-sama, it is mostly take. 'Let's see what fscked-up situation I can put Kyoko into today! GAH HAH HAH!!")

Thinking further I think I can draw some parallels too on Samael's "truth policy" (xD) and the very nature of narration in NGE, and it's cruel way of presenting the truth.

Yes, these themes all tie together rather nicely, no? Maybe things I only subconsciously realized about NGE took tangible form in BES, from where I finally realized their true power and substance. It's kind of like... the Aliens needing to lay an egg, from which another egg-layer hatches who is dependent on an animal host before another Alien can actually be born. Or... something.

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 02:03 GMT

[OMF [ANF]]

Male!! The Lance is male!!

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 02:22 GMT

[Magami No ER [ANF]]

Feel not. When the Muses take the stone mallet to my fractured braincase again, the soul of the Raptorian Sector will be transferred to its new vessel, the Garden of Tebel (a shameless reference to BES that nonetheless sounds rather nice and encompasses pretty much everything that will be on my site). Meantime, I would prefer if everyone forgot that TRS exists right now... It is the fossilized website of a young woman who has undergone at least five years of evolution since.

That's good to here. You certainly have of fan of the site though, here. XD

Well, hurry your arse up! teh Reichu is waiting!

Stuck at the Cape, leave a meassage after the beep. When I'm home, I can.^^;

Although I suppose I have plenty of stuff to keep me busy. Such as these troubling yaoi visions that continue to plague me.

Why does that seem so familar...>.>;





Yes, these themes all tie together rather nicely, no? Maybe things I only subconsciously realized about NGE took tangible form in BES, from where I finally realized their true power and substance. [/QUOTE]
I feel the like that when I watched Gundam, of all things. XD
My renewed interest in Eva(that goes the beyond the artistic inspiration it gave me, something I was dwindling on as of late)
came from finishing the melancoly Zeta(<3), actually. The fact that I connected with these Newtypes so rather...easily, I thought I could give this "connection buiness" with Eva's characters.
Watching older, regular & super robot(Ideon, Eva's biggest inspiration) anime titles has put that "mecha" perspective into light for me in Eva as well, seeing as the Evas seem to just transform from these "seemingly" mechanical humanoids to giant bodies holding deep secrets and motives. The harpies? they're just cool.
Strange...regular robots brought me back to Eva.
EDIT: Sorry it took me so long to fix this typing mess up. -__-

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 02:25 GMT

[Shifty [ANF]]

Just wondering if ne1 could fill me in on whats going on here.
(its not that im this lazy just that i just registerd and am looking for an excuse to post)

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 02:35 GMT

[Reichu [ANF]]

Male!![/b] The Lance is male!!

It satisfies as the "male element" on a Freudian level, but this says no more about the Spear's true nature than EVA-01's horn says about hers. I would say "Close, but no cigar", except that evaluating the Spear on the basis of a sex is completely irrelevent.

Just wondering if ne1 could fill me in on whats going on here.
(its not that im this lazy just that i just registerd and am looking for an excuse to post)

"I'm sorry, but I can't do that." You'll get "filled in" the same as everybody else, due to my employment of this idea about how individual effort is a very important part of realizing a "truth" that somebody else has already uncovered. And, as I've said before, treating everyone else like a baby who ought to be spoon-fed everything is just completely disrepectful, in my opinion.

Originally posted on: 28-Dec-2005, 04:19 GMT