Kaworu....Clone?

Cyanna · Postby **Cyanna** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 4:40 pm

This thread is more for speculation and theories rather then factual discussion.

We all know that Rei and Kaworu share similar pasts. In the manga we see Kaworu in a tube similar to the one that Rei is sometimes floating in. Nerv's dummy plug system is based off of Rei. Seele's is based off of Kaworu (his name is on the mass prod plugs). Kaworu is an angel. Rei is an angel.

Rei has an entire aquarium of clones...and we suspect that Yui is the one who supplied some (if not all) of the DNA.

And Kaworu? Since he has has all of these dummy plugs does he have all of these clones? And if so...whose DNA was taken?

Esion · Postby **Esion** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:29 pm

Gendo perhaps? That'd be a plot twist to be sure.

Dave · Postby **Dave** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:49 pm

I don't believe Kaworu was created from any one persons DNA, nor do I believe Rei actually has Yui's DNA. Rei was created from the lcl left over from Yui's contact experiment, and I don't think lcl has any double helixs floating around in it. This still begs the question though, from whose lcl was Kaworu created?

MongolSquad · Postby **MongolSquad** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 9:57 pm

He was cloned from Adam. Makes sense.

the_seventh_child · Postby **the_seventh_child** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 4:55 am

cain luppus wrote:He was cloned from Adam. Makes sense.

Esion · Postby **Esion** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 7:32 am

Alright, so if Nerv has a big tank full of Rei clones then does it not make sense that there would also be a tank full of Kaworu clones?

Phaze · Postby **Phaze** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 5:04 pm

The Rei clones were there for a reason, to replace Rei in the case of an accident. Kaworu only had one objective, to initiate Third Impact. There's not much of a need for Kaworu clones.
If Kaworu was cloned from Adam, he would look like Adam, because he owuld have the same genetic information. Not to mention he houses Adam's soul. If he had been cloned from Adam, he would technically be Adam.

Esion · Postby **Esion** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 6:08 pm

That's what I was thinking Phaze. He has to have some human componants in him. He looks human and for the most part as a human's AT Field (or at least one that simulates a humans AT field for interactive purposes).

Koworu was used to design the mass produced eva entry plugs wasn't he? I suppose he wasn't directly in combat so maybe they wouldn't have clones but you'd think they would do it just in case.

Dave · Postby **Dave** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 6:53 pm

I know this is a bit off topic but I think it has a lot in common with Kaworu. Anyway, how exactly did Gendou get Lilith's soul back into Rei III after Rei II killed herself?

Postby **Shin-seiki** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 8:01 pm

Dave wrote:I know this is a bit off topic but I think it has a lot in common with Kaworu. Anyway, how exactly did Gendou get Lilith's soul back into Rei III after Rei II killed herself?

Well, it seems to be relevant that they show us that there is something physically left of Rei II after the explosion:
http://homepage.mac.com/csf2860/Storybo ... hot_01.jpg

Here's a storyboard image that shows what we're looking at a little clearer:
http://homepage.mac.com/csf2860/Storybo ... ed_Rei.jpg

Note how Ritsuko announces "This is top secret. Retreive the plug..."
This scene correlates with the idea that, in NGE, the soul lingers in the body after death, since otherwise no soul > no AT Field > people would revert to LCL at death.

In the Director's Cut of #23, a new scene is added with Gendo and Fuyutsuki standing before the Dummy System contraption down in the Reiquarium:

Fuyutsuki:
Rei... the product of my despair, and yet the object of your hope.
I guess it's impossible to forget her...

This scene is inserted immediately before Rei III appears. This would seem to imply that they somehow retreived Rei's soul from Rei II's remains and used the Dummy System Tube to invest her soul into another clone from the clone tank.

Dave · Postby **Dave** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 8:38 pm

Shin-Seiki that idea is... perfect. It makes total sense! Where would I be without you?

Esion · Postby **Esion** » Fri Sep 24, 2004 11:43 pm

That makes sense.

advent_child · Postby **advent_child** » Sat Sep 25, 2004 8:10 am

Phaze wrote:The Rei clones were there for a reason, to replace Rei in the case of an accident. Kaworu only had one objective, to initiate Third Impact. There's not much of a need for Kaworu clones.
If Kaworu was cloned from Adam, he would look like Adam, because he owuld have the same genetic information. Not to mention he houses Adam's soul. If he had been cloned from Adam, he would technically be Adam.

Phaze's right..

Cyanna · Postby **Cyanna** » Sat Sep 25, 2004 9:57 am

Then what is needed to create a dummy plug? Is it just imprinting personality? Or does the Eva have to sense a body (and a brain)? I've heard people joke around about "Rei juice" in the plug...which would lead me to believe that the clones do serve another purpose besides replacement. But if it's personality imprinting...that really says something about Rei's violent side.

sadsadshinji · Postby **sadsadshinji** » Sun Sep 26, 2004 12:52 am

not Rei's violent side....maybe evas? because there would be nothing controlling the eva's instincts (kinda like a toned down beserker mode?)
and i kind of agree with phaze...
and the clones would be empty vessels, just like the reis of the reiquarium...
while on the subject...what is the dummy plug? i always thought it had to do with the empty reis...

YouTube · Postby **Reichu** » Sat Oct 02, 2004 4:05 pm

I'm a proponent of the idea that Kaworu is a clone of Misato's father, myself... See more here.

Cogboy · Postby **Cogboy** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:22 am

Ok. here is my understanding of the dummy plug system.

Evas need a human pilot to synchronise with.
In the dummy plug system, a Rei or kaworu clone is hooked up inside an entry plug to trick the eva into synchronising.
The eva is then controlled by a computer, specificly the digitised thought patterns of the pilot.

In the backup dummy plug, which is what we saw in action destroying unit 3, There is already a pilot right? (Shinji) So this time a clone is not needed.
They simply replace the thought patterns of Shinji with the digitised version of Rei's.

Whaddaya think eh? :wink:

advent_child · Postby **advent_child** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 6:17 am

Cogboy wrote:Ok. here is my understanding of the dummy plug system.

Evas need a human pilot to synchronise with.
In the dummy plug system, a Rei or kaworu clone is hooked up inside an entry plug to trick the eva into synchronising.
The eva is then controlled by a computer, specificly the digitised thought patterns of the pilot.

In the backup dummy plug, which is what we saw in action destroying unit 3, There is already a pilot right? (Shinji) So this time a clone is not needed.
They simply replace the thought patterns of Shinji with the digitised version of Rei's.

Whaddaya think eh?

that's an interesting thought..

sadsadshinji · Postby **sadsadshinji** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:54 am

i thought that was what it was...
although it seems as though they have to use the Rei clones...
and reichu...i dont know what to say...

Postby **thewayneiac** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 2:02 pm

How exactly the Rei tank is, "the core of the Dummy System", is one of the toughest things to figure out in the series. However, there is evidence that the Rei clones aren't physically being turned into Dummy Plugs. In ep. 23, if you look closely at the controller in Ritsuko's hand when she's about to destroy the Reis, the readout has a Rei list that starts with Rei-04. Thus only 3 are missing: one throttled, one self-destructed, and one current.

Kaworu....Clone?

Kaworu....Clone?

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