Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Cartmilk » Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:35 pm

Slightly confused as to if the soul of Asuka's mom is in unit 02, as Mari was able to easily activate and pilot it. Is there non-specificity to activating the EVAs in the rebuild?

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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby pwhodges » Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:32 pm

Beware of trying to take across knowledge from the series into Rebuild - we know much less about souls in the Evas for the films compared with the original, and I'm pretty sure the mothers thing hasn't come up at all.
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Blockio » Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:20 pm

View Original Postpwhodges wrote:and I'm pretty sure the mothers thing hasn't come up at all.

Yui is confirmed to be in Unit 01, but other than that nothing
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Sun Dec 16, 2018 8:55 am

^Right, Unit 01 is the only Eva confirmed or really even suggested to have a human soul housed inside. There is something in the others as there have been multiple instances of Evas moving on their own.

*Unit 00 goes berserk in 1.0 and continues operating even after it ejects Rei.
*Unit 05 also goes berserk and Mari turns over some of the controls to it.
*Unit 02 and the Vessel of the Adams keep fighting after both of their pilots eject. The Vessel is a little iffy since it was running some kind of Seele OS but Unit 02 definitely wasn't.

In the movies, a pilot swapping Evas is apparently as simple as swapping out settings in the core. Unit 01 was being switched over to the "L-00 Type" when it looked like Rei was going to pilot it, and when Mari is gearing up to pilot Unit 02, the background chatter mentions that the core is being reconfigured with Mari being set as the designated pilot. It's pretty hard to hear because of all the other noise going on.
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:51 pm

Here’s a better question: Does Asuka still even have a mom? There’s been this nebulous consensus among the Japanese VA cast and filmmakers that the “Nami” names are shared between the characters Ayanami, Shikinami, and Makinami for a specific reason, but that reason hasn’t been revealed yet.

Ayanami doesn’t need a mother’s soul to pilot her Eva. Maybe the same is true for the other two Namis? I know their Eva’s cores need to be switched out and stuff, but do cores require a mother’s soul?

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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Blockio » Mon Dec 17, 2018 10:49 am

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:that the “Nami” names are shared between the characters Ayanami, Shikinami, and Makinami for a specific reason, but that reason hasn’t been revealed yet.

Since all three of those are the names of post-WWII destroyers, I am willing to accept it as just that without a deeper meaning to it
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Mon Dec 17, 2018 10:55 am

^ And for all we know, that could have been the only specific reasoning behind it. It's just weird to me that Shinji is the only one who's mom being in the Unit Unit is vital to its operation, and everyone else can be hand-waved by core transplants and stuff.

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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Mon Dec 17, 2018 11:20 am

I'm inclined to think that they don't and that the Children are either synchronizing directly with the Eva's native soul or that Nerv was able to create some kind of AI construct that is able to perform the same function, maybe using Yui as a blueprint. I believe Reichu once speculated they might be using the same sort of imprint technology as the Magi.

But it seems to me that it's the Children who have some kind of special property this time around. We haven't heard anything about the class being potential candidates this time around. It seems to be just those 5/6.

Asuka's parentage is a very good question. She hasn't mentioned any family at all. No mama, no papa, or even her step mom or any kind of foster/guardian besides Misato. But at the same time she doesn't seem to be burdened by her family or lack thereof besides her general feeling of lonliness.

I feel like that woman with glasses in Fuyutsui's photo may be Asuka's mother, or at least the person Asuka is based on if she's artificially created. Even Rei doesn't look exactly like Yui.

There could be something to the whole -nami thing. The biggest issue I see with that is that Ayanami was Yui's maiden name in this continuity. If it was like the old continuity where Rei was the only Ayanami we knew of then it'd make a lot more sense.

I'm on board with the theory that Shinji is the real soul of Unit 01 and that Yui went into it in his place so that its power could be used and controlled. That may explain why it has an AT Field but Unit 13 does not.
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Joseki » Mon Dec 17, 2018 12:42 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:^ And for all we know, that could have been the only specific reasoning behind it. It's just weird to me that Shinji is the only one who's mom being in the Unit Unit is vital to its operation, and everyone else can be hand-waved by core transplants and stuff.


Minna no Eva made a video about the naming symmetry. It's in Japanese but the subtitles are clear enough to understand her general point.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZK9Ti-B_lA

View Original PostBlueBasilisk wrote:But it seems to me that it's the Children who have some kind of special property this time around. We haven't heard anything about the class being potential candidates this time around. It seems to be just those 5/6.


I think we may go as far as taking "the kids are special" as a fact in the Rebuild universe. In Jo SEELE agrees that recruiting Shinji is a must for their plan, in Ha Gendo and Fuyu says that it's Rei and Yui who awakened Unit 01. Shinji also turn Unit 01 berserk at the end of Ha and Mari/Asuka can go beast mode. All 3 undergo physical transformations in the process and may have inhuman strenght (Shinji in Ha, Asuka in Q).

Plus, they don't age. That's not normal (but it may be Eva induced).
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Reichu » Fri Dec 21, 2018 10:02 am

@Blue Basilisk: The thread you're thinking of is below. Intimidating but interesting read for those who missed it the first time.

post/877924/Mark-09-Adams-Vessel-Unit-13-and-the-stolen-AAA-WUNDER/#877924

About the photograph lady, it's possible she's connected to Asuka as well, but if I had to pick one -nami to link her to I'd say Maki-. The glasses, the darker hair, the pink stripes on her blouse. Mari also calls Gendo "Gendo-kun", strongly conveying a sense of familiarity -- one that might make sense if she spent time at the Hakone AEL as a little girl.

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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:50 am

^Yeah, that's the one. What a fun discussion that was but man does it ever remind me how much I hate the Vessel of the Adams. :lol: I say as have a figure of it coming in the mail...

She could be Mari-related too. Something about the design just says Asuka to me. Maybe it's the hair style and clips. But it does make me wonder if they'd use Sadamoto's design for Kyoko if she's still Asuka's mother, because that lady in the picture doesn't look anything like Kyoko.

What is Asuka and how does she fit into the overall picture? Shinji is inextricably linked to the Eva Project through his parents, through the prophecy of the Dead Sea Scrolls, and possibly through other factors. Rei is one part Lilith, one part Yui, was created by the project, and is an essential component to Gendo and Yui's plans. Kaworu is the First Angel (whatever that means) and is also a key element of the prophecy.

But then you have Asuka and Mari. Mari is in the know about lots of secrets and is well-connected through Kaji, but it doesn't seem like she is a factor in Seele's plans and is only part of Gendo's as a matter of convenience. Asuka isn't really even that. She's just...what, one extra butt to fill a seat? She says she had to work hard to get her position (and she is very skilled) but what exactly was the alternative? Nerv has more Evas than pilots and the dummy plug wasn't ready until part way through 2.0. Was Seele just going to let those Evas sit idly until they had dummy plugs? I know one of the draft scripts talked about the pilot of Unit 03 possibly being a human sacrifice, but even then it seemed like they intended Rei to do it since they were so intent on decommissioning Unit 00.
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Joseki » Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:07 pm

^

The lady in the picture has both Mari's and Asuka's traits, but going by the out of universe genetic laws of anime I'd say she's more likely to be Asuka's mother than Mari's mother, as the the lady has Asuka's hairs and generally parents and children have the same hairs (Shinji has hairs very similar to Gendo; Rei is just small Yui, but she's a clone so it makes sense in universe too).

Alternatevely, Mari and Asuka are step sister, their mom is in the core of Unit 02 and it explains why Mari was able to pilot the Eva fairly easily in 2.0. :devil:
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Reichu » Mon Dec 24, 2018 6:01 pm

View Original PostJoseki wrote:I'd say she's more likely to be Asuka's mother than Mari's mother, as the the lady has Asuka's hairs and generally parents and children have the same hairs

It might be done up in a kinda sorta Asuka sort of style, but the color is the same as Mari's hair.

SPOILER: Show
Image
Image
Image


So to compare and contrast here...

Connections with Mari:
- same hair color
- wears glasses that are red (or very dark pink)
- wears pink
- has a shared past with the Ikari family

Connections with Asuka:
- uses a red clip to hold hair back

Like, the mystery lady is probably going to be linked to both Mari and Asuka, but the Mari connections are far more overt.

Is this actually important at all? Until/unless further information is revealed, I'd say it is. Asuka's past is basically a total blank, to the point where the one visual link between the photo lady and Asuka is an orphaned hint (i.e., connected to nothing else). On the other hand, the combination of this photo and Mari's use of "Gendo-kun" does provide some basis to speculate about Mari. Namely, it suggests that Mari was present at the Hakone AEL with her mother. This also means that she and Shinji probably met as children, but we know that Shinji has been subjected to memory wiping so that could explain why he doesn't remember her.

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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Tue Dec 25, 2018 2:01 am

^I think her bangs are more like Mari's too. Asuka's have a lot of volume and are separated from the rest of her hair:
SPOILER: Show
Image

But that lady's aren't. They lay relatively flat against her head.

The only real hint we have about Asuka's past is this:
SPOILER: Show
Image

It's the biggest clue that a certain trauma from Asuka's past might not be present in this version. I can't see Sohryu carrying around any kind of doll as a comfort object with the way she was tormented by that doll her mother had. It's either hand made or it's seen a rough life and has been patched up a fair bit. Did someone give it to her? Did she make it herself? It's hard to imagine a kid her age not having some kind of caretaker or legal guardian, but Misato seems to be the only person Asuka is willing to make connections with, at least at first.
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Re: Is the soul of Asuka's mom still inside Unit 02?

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Postby Joseki » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:06 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:Please don't quote an entire when you're only responding to a small part. --Reichu


I thought about the glasses for a bit, but to me they feel like a red herring, a bad eyesight isn't usually genetic in anine. But as you said, it's likely that she's connected to both Asuka and Mari.
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