What happen to Soryu ?

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby Ekonomi122 » Thu Dec 28, 2017 10:25 pm

Why anno change soryu name being Shinikami ? What happen to Soryu ? Did anno ignore her or he want make Asuka being more different character ? :huh:

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Postby Guy Nacks » Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:08 pm

We don't know for sure yet.

There are many of us that expect that 3.0 + 1.0 will address this. Many, including myself, have theorized that there is a significant narrative reason for Anno changing her name so that she purposefully adopts the "-nami" naming convention of all the main female pilots in the series. (Rei Aya-NAMI, Mari Makin-NAMI, Asuka Shiki-NAMI).

One theory is that they're all different iterations of clones, probably all cloned from different aspects of Shinji's mother, who also had her surname changed--Instead of being Yui Ikari, she's now Yui Aya-NAMI.
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Re: What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:41 pm

^ Talk about Oedipus to the extreme. So, the theory is that Asuka, Mari, and Rei are Shinji's MAGI, which would make him... basically Jesus? Doesn't seem more far reaching than Shinji and Asuka having had sex, and it wouldn't be the most outlandish thing about NGE considering the Mari is a time traveler theories.
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Postby Cybermat47 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:26 am

View Original PostGuy Nacks wrote:One theory is that they're all different iterations of clones, probably all cloned from different aspects of Shinji's mother, who also had her surname changed--Instead of being Yui Ikari, she's now Yui Aya-NAMI.


I’d write something worthwhile here, but between that theory and Doki Doki Literature Club, my brain has way too much insanity to process.
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Postby Chuckman » Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:11 am

View Original PostDarkBluePhoenix wrote:^ Talk about Oedipus to the extreme. So, the theory is that Asuka, Mari, and Rei are Shinji's MAGI, which would make him... basically Jesus? Doesn't seem more far reaching than Shinji and Asuka having had sex, and it wouldn't be the most outlandish thing about NGE considering the Mari is a time traveler theories.


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Postby Cybermat47 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:12 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:Three incarnations of the tripartite goddess. Maid, matron, and crone.


They’re all maids in the traditional sense of the word (an unmarried woman), but how are any of them matrons or crones?
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Re: What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby Joseki » Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:56 am

— Concerning Mari’s naming, I believe [the name] came from Anno-san, but what was the source for it?

Anno: Illustrious is the name of an English aircraft carrier. Makinami comes, not from the former Imperial Navy, but from the Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force’s Ayanami class of destroyers [escort ships]. Shikinami is the same. I don’t know whether or not I will bring this out in the main work, but in the new films, I altered the settei of the Eva pilots compared to the original. Because of this, Asuka[’s name] changed as well, from Soryu to Shikinami. As for the name Mari, I originally got the name Mariko from a character who appeared in my wife’s (Moyoco Anno) manga, but for various reasons it was changed to Mari. Well, Bucchan [Yutaka Izubuchi] was also probably pleased with the change (laughs).

— What was the reason for changing Asuka’s name to Shikinami?

Anno: I mentioned this before, but, because I changed the settei relating to the Eva pilots, in order to provide consistency in accordance with that I thought it was best to change the name. I also thought that the change in name of a main character would enable viewers from the previous work to receive the message, This time is different, a new feeling. Of course I felt uncomfortable [about it], and there are things that I think are better in the original, but here I feel like I [had to] risk changing things. [?] As I thought that fans from the original work would probably not expect changes to the extent that Asuka’s name would be changed, I wondered if the sense that, Ah, this is different than before could be conveyed in a shocking and easy-to-understand way; and I wondered if it might be good as a topic [for conversation] as well.




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Re: What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby Ekonomi122 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 5:31 am

View Original PostJoseki wrote:In Anno's mind there's a reason for the change, but we may never know.


So The reason why Anno want replace Soryu with Shikinami because he like it ? Not something important ?

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Postby pwhodges » Fri Dec 29, 2017 6:19 am

Um, the quotes above give two distinct reasons.
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Re: What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Fri Dec 29, 2017 7:34 am

Yuko Miyamura (Asuka's Japanese voice actress) claims to know the reason for the name change.As someone who is fond os Asuka's character, I do appreciate the fact that Soryu and Shikinami are two more distinctly different persons than the rest of the cast is.

I do like the idea that the "Nami" girls all have a unifying narrative purpose, but anything I would post beyond this would be pure speculation. I'm just anxious to see what it is.

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Postby Mr. Tines » Fri Dec 29, 2017 7:56 am

View Original PostDarkBluePhoenix wrote:considering the Mari is a time traveler theories.
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Postby Blockio » Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:45 am

This may sound a bit trivial in comparison to the other theories, but:
IJN Ayanami = Destroyer
IJN Makinami = Destroxer
IJN Shikinami = Destroyer
IJN Soryu = Aircraft carrier

Wwhich would also make sense when comparing the second names:
HMS Illustrious = Aircraft carrier
USS Langley = Aircraft Carrier
(DKM) Graf Zeppelin (aka Kyokos last name) - Aircraft carrier


Basically, in the rebuilds all three have at least partially destroyer names, while in the original Asuka is purely aircraft carrier (wow, that sounds weird)
I dont know if this has any significance, but I felt like this is an intersting detail and might be important for something
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Postby TheChosenJuan » Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:32 am

makes about as much sense as the rebuilds in general. sure, you could interpret a lot into it, but it could also just be because he wanted to show that something changed in the second rebuild from the original series.
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Re: What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:59 pm

I think Soryu has been divided into three aspects, the pilot, the girl, and the doll.

I'm sure she'll be back in Final.
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Re: What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby TheChosenJuan » Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:17 am

View Original PostChaddyManPrime wrote:I think Soryu has been divided into three aspects, the pilot, the girl, and the doll.

I'm sure she'll be back in Final.


So, in the way that she metaphysically divided into three persons or clones? Or in a rather stylistic way, that Anno just shows three stages of her "former" self from the show?
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Postby C.T.1290 » Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:25 pm

I honestly don't think there's much of a difference between the two. This is Asuka we're talking about here, the same as ever.
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Postby Blockio » Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:38 am

View Original PostC.T.1290 wrote:I honestly don't think there's much of a difference between the two. This is Asuka we're talking about here, the same as ever.

:facepalm:
Thats actually not even coming close. Soryu and Shikinami are very different both in their lore (most notable examples being that Shikinami is a captain and already knows Misato before meeting her on-screen), how they interact with others (mainly with Shinji, this has been discussed in great detail over here, or the fact that she isn't friends with Hikari in NTE) and their overall psyche (best example being the handdoll that would probably cause PTSD for Soryu, but is one of Shikinami's favorite items)

Some more differences between Soryu and Shikinami
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Re: What happen to Soryu ?

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Postby C.T.1290 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:21 am

View Original PostBlockio wrote::facepalm:
Thats actually not even coming close. Soryu and Shikinami are very different both in their lore (most notable examples being that Shikinami is a captain and already knows Misato before meeting her on-screen), how they interact with others (mainly with Shinji, this has been discussed in great detail over here, or the fact that she isn't friends with Hikari in NTE) and their overall psyche (best example being the handdoll that would probably cause PTSD for Soryu, but is one of Shikinami's favorite items)

Some more differences between Soryu and Shikinami

That may be so with the examples shown there. But personality wise, she's about the same there. The essence of the old Asuka is still there, despite being a different person. Not sure if she is supposed to be an improvement over Soryu, or an Asuka 2.0. She is basically just wearing her face (and plugsuit), and acts like her too. So therefore, she is not completely different from her old self.
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Postby Blockio » Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:20 am

View Original PostC.T.1290 wrote:That may be so with the examples shown there. But personality wise, she's about the same there. The essence of the old Asuka is still there, despite being a different person. Not sure if she is supposed to be an improvement over Soryu, or an Asuka 2.0. She is basically just wearing her face (and plugsuit), and acts like her too. So therefore, she is not completely different from her old self.

I rest my case.
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Postby Reichu » Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:06 pm

View Original PostBlockio wrote:Soryu and Shikinami are very different both in their lore (most notable examples being that Shikinami is a captain and already knows Misato before meeting her on-screen)

Episode 22' wrote:Asuka (OFF):
Man, I guess we will be in Japan by tomorrow.
And Misato said she'd come pick me up by lunch.
Oh, Misato's the person who was in Germany before you, Mr. Kaji.
I don't really like her much.
The way she lives is so affected.


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