Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby TheCarkolum » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:48 am

Maybe it's just me, but I think Armisael is the only Angel I feel like knowing more about it, because it seems it's capable of doing things that defy all logic or explanation, like shifting blood type or shape, rotating weirdly, "reviving" all previous angels (I mean, wtf), etc. To me, it's the only one. I mean, Leliel's Dirac sea is intriguing and so, but the difference is there's not much more in Leliel. Arael is maybe the only one, apart from Armisael, that remains of a mystery because we never see it actually "fighting", but again, the only characteristics we see is the psychic beam.
All in Armisael is intriguing: attacks, defense, shape, powers...
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:57 pm

Well I think that all the angels that interact with the children were special and unique, they were coreless and without an S2 engine. There was no traditional way of killing them. It also offered the Children their first real taste of Instrumentality.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby imprimatur13 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:11 pm

View Original PostChaddyManPrime wrote: they were coreless and without an S2 engine.

I like the rest of your post, but is that really true? It's been a while, but I thought ALL Adam's children had cores and S2's within them... Fruit of Life and all. How else did they work? I.e., what was their power source, then? Gotta come from somewhere...
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:37 pm

Well Arael and Armisael appear energy beings, there's no way Rei was able to hit Arael straight through his core, she kinda threw the lance and hope it pierced him, which she did. He just poofed out of existence, and there was no explosion. Explosion usually signifies that the core or S2 engine being destroyed.

Armisael's more iffy for me cause I don't know if it was Rei's or it's explosion we saw. I think it was just Rei's cause Armisael was inside her Unit, bonding with it was the only way to kill it.I don't remember seeing a cross explosion either.

And there is no way hell Shinji destroyed Leilel's core or S2 engine, he wouldn't even know where to look for it in that dimension. He just tore it's body apart and it's bubble burst.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby Reichu » Tue Sep 05, 2017 11:32 pm

Arael's core is floating between the "arm" wings on the Angel's underside. It's pretty hard to see, but it's there. Stupidly, the Spear doesn't pierce the core, but the Angel's main body.

Leliel's core is most likely the glowing red stuff that cracks open beneath the flat "shadow" body when the Angel dies. (Also, Yui killed the Angel, not Shinji.)

Dunno what's going on with Armisael.

EDIT: Remembered some things wrong.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby The Eva Monkey » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:26 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:Dunno what's going on with Armisael.

Well, in 23', Armisael does bleed when Shinji stabs it with his progressive knife. Last I checked, beings made of pure energy don't have blood.

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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:30 am

Oh, Rei is right about Arael, there is brief flash of red when hit, just no explosion probably due to the vacuum of space.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby TheCarkolum » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:51 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Dunno what's going on with Armisael.


You see what I mean ? Even the core is a weird thing about Armisael.

One thing I forgot to mention is, whereas the other angels have a very complex form, or "detail" shape if you want (humanoid monsters or plain monsters, trippy things...), Armisael looks just like very simple, like a ring or whatever.

ChaddyManPrime wrote: I don't know if it was Rei's or it's explosion we saw


I've always thought the first explosion was the EVA 00 and the second one was Armisael...

ChaddyManPrime wrote:all the angels that interact with the children were special and unique


You mean Leliel and Arael, right? Well, idk. Leliel is cool and all, but lately it just seems lame... EVA-01 killed it super easily, yeah Dirac sea and all but it feels underutilized eventually. Just pretty easy to kill.
Arael? Yeah, I love Arael. But to be fair, we don't see too much of it. It seems the only thing he can do is rape your mind, at least the show never shows us more.
Armisael is the real thing.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby Sachi » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:12 pm

Leliel was not easy to kill. It rendered the Evas completely powerless, and required the deus ex machina of Unit-01 going berserk in order to be defeated. Remember that Ep 16 is only the second time we see an Eva go berserk in combat (third time ever, if we include Unit-00's initial activation test). Ep 16 is a neat turning point in the series, and both Leliel embodies it completely.

Arael and Armisael can be quite forgettable, if I say so myself. :nyao:
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby imprimatur13 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:21 pm

View Original PostSachi wrote:Arael and Armisael can be quite forgettable, if I say so myself. :nyao:

By which you mean, the Angels themselves. Obviously, the "mind-invasion" stuff is not forgettable at all...
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(Isn't it funny, by the way, the hoops we go through not to refer to the Angels with singular pronouns? Because, they're human, so we can't call an Angel "it"; but we also can't really say "he" or "she" because their genders (if they have any) are unknown... An epicene pronoun, such as Ido's "lu", would be ideal here :).)
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby Reichu » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:29 pm

View Original PostSachi wrote:Arael and Armisael can be quite forgettable, if I say so myself. :nyao:

Arael is a bird Angel and therefore the epitome of Angel-dom. (Birds are dinosaurs and dinosaurs are awesome.)

Armisael is not only moe, she is pure Lovecraftian horror. Her inane giggling might as well be a refrain of "teke-li-li". Despite taking on Rei's appearance, there was very little that happened in that encounter that is within the ken of mortal (wo)man.

TheCarkolum wrote:Armisael looks just like very simple, like a ring or whatever.

Before fusing, it resembles a plasmid.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby TheCarkolum » Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:38 am

View Original PostSachi wrote:Leliel was not easy to kill. It rendered the Evas completely powerless, and required the deus ex machina of Unit-01 going berserk in order to be defeated.

That's because they didn't know the only thing they needed to do is waiting for the EVA to go Berserk and that's it. Hence it was pretty easy to kill because they didn't have to do anything. I mean, if my TV doesn't work for 5 hours and then fixes itself, it was pretty easy to fix.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby Sachi » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:54 am

Waiting for an Eva to go berserk is not reliable. By that logic, all they needed to do with Armisael was wait for Rei to be impaled and then self-destruct.

Both Leliel and Armisael are examples of Angels that were defeated out of dumb luck that probably would not have been killed under any other circumstance. I honestly can't think of any other Angel that would qualify, although plenty do a great job of creating near hopeless situations.

And if I had to pick one of the two that was more qualified as theoretically undefeatable, it would be Leliel.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby TheCarkolum » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:26 am

View Original PostSachi wrote:Waiting for an Eva to go berserk is not reliable. By that logic, all they needed to do with Armisael was wait for Rei to be impaled and then self-destruct.

Except that meant to sacrifice a human being, destroy an entire city and lose an EVA. The cost was tremendous, so it is not a easy decision, but it was the only way. And in that case, waiting for the EVA 01 was quite reliable. Leaving the Dirac sea looked pretty easy for Yui, I mean, there were 3 times in the show when Yui needed to act, and she acted. So, by your logic, Sachiel was pretty difficult too, because Shinji was not capable to pilot the EVA yet and no one was able to face Sachiel but Yui. I mean, it's not something random the activation of Yui in the series, you know, it happens when it needs to happen. Yui is like another pilot or some sort, in my opinion. It's the back-up of Shinji when he fails.

View Original PostSachi wrote:And if I had to pick one of the two that was more qualified as theoretically undefeatable, it would be Leliel.


You think so? I mean, take away the berserk mode and the self-destruction thing. How can you defeat Armisael? Eva 02 is inoperable, Eva 00 and Eva 01 are mentally contaminated and you can't launch any offensive against the thing. Now, against Leliel you got 2 EVAs, a plan which might or might not work (throwing a bunch of N2 bombs) and Ritsuko who can make her research about the thing all the time she wants (let's assume Shinji dies). Clearly I'd pick Armisael, I don't know "theoretically", but with Leliel you got more cards in your favor.
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Re: Does anybody feel like knowing more about Armisael?

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Postby Sachi » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:45 am

Yes, Sachiel was difficult. Maybe a weaker Angel overall, but against an inexperienced Eva it nearly won, losing only because of the berserk. Circumstances matter, I know. Which is why I don't consider Sachiel in the same league as Leliel or Armisael; those two would shine regardless of circumstance.

A berserk Eva is a wildcard because it's unpredictable. It could simply not happen, and everyone would be screwed. Like Misato says, man has to create their own miracles, not wait for one to happen.
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"So you are saying it's the human heart that throws the world into confusion."


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