Superhero/Comic Based Films & Tv - Vol.2

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Re: Superhero/Comic Based Films & Tv - Vol.2

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Postby Chuckman » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:53 pm

I’m rewatching Justice League.

They just have recut the shit out of this movie. How did Bruce grow a full beard flying from Gotham City to Iceland?

Makes me really wonder what happened in the original version. Something made him stop being Batman?
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Postby Ray » Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:59 am

What Else can you expect from WB at this point? It was f*cked from the start, and all they could do was Frankenstein it and hope it would be better received than the last one, and then move forward from there.

Not that there's likely to BE a forward to move on to.

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Postby Chuckman » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:47 pm

Well, we can agree that it was fucked at the start. :devil:

What the can do now is do a Crisis movie and reboot. That introduces your audience to the concept of "These are the same characters portrayed by the same actors but they're different people".

Then you make a DC Universe film series where Batman and Superman have no solo films, are older than the main characters of most of the main characters, and are portrayed by seasoned actors, which the exception of Diana who is immortal and always looks the same anyway.

Instead of trying to ape Marvel with a "present at the creation" storyline where they make a movie about one superhero in a vacuum leading to the explosive birth of a universe ("I'm here to talk to you about the Avengers Initiative" style) they make some movies about new inexperienced heroes set in an existing universe.

I'd make it with a sliding time scale so that the Reeves/Donner Superman movies and Burton Batman movies are vaguely implied to be part of the backstory with no specifics confirmed, only broad strokes, and flesh out the backstory later with period piece movies if there is sufficient interest. If I had a magic wand (doubt he'd do it, but since we're speculating) I'd bring Keaton back as an ex-Batman Bruce Wayne leading a Batman initiative and supporting other superheroes while Tom Hanks portrays a Superman who is a flying, godly Fred Rogers.

That way you can have your cake and eat it, too. You get your Batman without making it about him and you can have your Superman spectacle without dealing with all those thorny issues that hollywood is too scared to touch, like human nature or Superman fighting slum lords and corrupt senators or famines, but you get the quasi-familiarity of a character like, say, Nightwing that people can connect to but aren't walking into theaters with a pre-conceived idea of.

I'd start this new DCCU with either a Nightwing movie, a Flash movie, or a movie where Batgirl and Power Girl team up. The movies would be totally self contained stories with sequel/continuity teases at the end and culminate in a two-part Teen Titans movie where they team up solve X threat but it ends on a cliffhanger and a nice prestige scene where the full Justice League show up for some sumptuous visual spectacle. Maybe focus it around Miss Martian/White Martians.
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Re: Superhero/Comic Based Films & Tv - Vol.2

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Postby AdamMalkovitch » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:58 pm

Saw Black Panther Sunday afternoon, and I'm still in shock. I refuse to believe how good it was, especially after hating and being burned by superhero films since the mid 2000s. The cinematography, writing, characters, pacing and effects (except for the terrible looking cg rhinos) were all spectacular. I was concerned that I would have need to have watched Civil War again to understand what was happening, but unlike the majority of other recent Marvel films, this works on it's own as a self-contained narrative. The one reference to Civil War is fully explained and even shown on-screen, so new audiences won't be confused. The only things I didn't absolutely love were the aforementioned rhinos, and the forced "what're thooooose" joke in this otherwise incredible film, and yet, I still got enjoyment out of how bad those two very small elements were because the rest of the film put me in such a good mood. I'm very glad that modern racial tensions were, for the most part, left out, and only vaguely mentioned and eluded to by Killmonger, who I still think is a great "villain" in the same way Gendo is- he's only doing what he believes is right. Sure, he's being a dick about it, but this is his personal justice, he doesn't see himself as evil. All in all, if Homecoming, Civil War, Guardians Vol. 2, and this film are indicators of Marvel's future film quality, I may have to take back what I said about every superhero film being the same, tired narrative with the same recycled story beats under a different title, always playing it safe. I can't wait for Infinity War.
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Re: Superhero/Comic Based Films & Tv - Vol.2

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Postby Ray » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:02 pm

[DELETED}
Last edited by Ray on Fri Mar 05, 2021 4:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby Chuckman » Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:54 pm

View Original PostAdamMalkobitch wrote:Saw Black Panther Sunday afternoon, and I'm still in shock. I refuse to believe how good it was, especially after hating and being burned by superhero films since the mid 2000s. The cinematography, writing, characters, pacing and effects (except for the terrible looking cg rhinos) were all spectacular. I was concerned that I would have need to have watched Civil War again to understand what was happening, but unlike the majority of other recent Marvel films, this works on it's own as a self-contained narrative. The one reference to Civil War is fully explained and even shown on-screen, so new audiences won't be confused. The only things I didn't absolutely love were the aforementioned rhinos, and the forced "what're thooooose" joke in this otherwise incredible film, and yet, I still got enjoyment out of how bad those two very small elements were because the rest of the film put me in such a good mood. I'm very glad that modern racial tensions were, for the most part, left out, and only vaguely mentioned and eluded to by Killmonger, who I still think is a great "villain" in the same way Gendo is- he's only doing what he believes is right. Sure, he's being a dick about it, but this is his personal justice, he doesn't see himself as evil. All in all, if Homecoming, Civil War, Guardians Vol. 2, and this film are indicators of Marvel's future film quality, I may have to take back what I said about every superhero film being the same, tired narrative with the same recycled story beats under a different title, always playing it safe. I can't wait for Infinity War.


I didn't really feel that was left out so much as the film decided to put some thought into it rather than pander.
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Postby Chuckman » Fri Feb 23, 2018 2:40 pm

The Hollywood reporter is saying Whedon is off Batgirl.
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Statistical fact: Cops will never pull over a man with a huge bong in his car. Why? They fear this man. They know he sees further than they and he will bind them with ancient logics. —Marty Mikalski

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Postby Ray » Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:11 pm

For once a DC director leaves and I'm actually okay with it.

From what I've been able to glean from the various articles about it what happened was that he was brought in to help " Salvage" Justice League and in exchange you would be given free reign on a solo DC movie. But only if the movie was a hit. And when it wasn't, both the studio and whedon lost out.

I like I said none of this matters anyway because they're doomed and they're never going to be able to compete with Marvel no matter how hard they try because they screwed the pooch so hard with JL.


Edit:
Midnight Edge gives their two cents on the whole When controversy.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hMwAZX2eIio

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Postby Guy Nacks » Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:33 pm

View Original PostChuckman wrote:The Hollywood reporter is saying Whedon is off Batgirl.


Joss Whedon wrote:"...it took me months to realize I really didn't have a story."


This, coming from one of the most prolific script doctors of the '90s and one of the most prolific screenwriters in geekdom as a whole.

I don't know if any statement in the entertainment industry has ever been more riddled with bullshit.
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Postby Ray » Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:16 pm

You could just do the Killing Joke except don't Paralyze her, and have her be the one to kick Jokers ass instead of Bats.

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:50 am

Shrug.

Whedon off Batgirl makes sense. He got the job before Wonder Woman became the biggest movie of last summer and Black Panther broke box office records last weekend. Those movies proved that not only can women & minority filmmakers handle giant blockbusters but that their presence can help make those films more appealing to broader audiences. If a white guy had directed Wonder Woman or Black Panther I really don't think either would have opened or done as well they did. By mere optics alone having a straight white male - let alone a straight white male with the recent allegations made against him - directing Batgirl instead of a female voice would have detrimentally hurt the film.

Frankly, while it might piss off Batman fanatics or people who can't look past their own myopic experiences, it should be female filmmakers who write &/or direct the first Batgirl movie. Women and minority filmmakers have always been looked over in this industry - women because they're "too fragile" or "not decisive enough" and minority filmmakers because "their ethnic views don't connect with broad (white) audiences", both arguments which have been proven to be false if the filmmaker as an individual had the vision - so it's great they're finally being Brough to the table in regards to these big jobs. Also, fyi, the toxic "This is political correctness BS, the right person should get the job" argument holds no sway because the assumption made by the person proposing it in scenarios such as this is ALWAYS that a famous straight white guy was really the best choice. Whedon exiting/being forced out of the project makes sense all things considered. He'll be fine. He'll either get another gig at DC, another film somewhere else (he did direct two movies that made north of $1.5 billion at the global box office each) or Netflix can write him a check for $300 million to make something. He'll be fine. Though if he really didn't have a story in place, it's not a good look for an industry where too few promising jobs are given to people in power who have no idea what they're doing.
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Postby Ray » Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:53 am

"This is political correctness BS, the right person should get the job" argument holds no sway because the assumption made by the person proposing it in scenarios such as this is ALWAYS that a famous straight white guy was really the best choice.


Is the 'no politics rule' not applicable anymore?

Also, while my opinion on the issues isn't exactly monochrome. I AM in opposition to what you say here. Mostly. We're just going to have to agree to disagree.

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:13 am

It's a complicated issue for sure. One that my Drunk-A-Bottle-Of-Red-Wine-Post-Intercourse-Can't-Go-To-Bed-So-I'm-Online can't approach with the correct nuance it needs and shouldn't derail the overall conversation here about comic book movies. For now though, I would say Whedon exiting Batgirl for someone else to take the gig is for the best. Regardless of whether he had a story or not.

On a lighter note, are they really going with The Untitled Deadpool Sequel as the title for Deadpool 2 cause if are did that would be AMAZING.

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Postby Chuckman » Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:26 am

That’s a good point. Batgirl is a perfect vehicle for another female-helmed film.
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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:23 pm

Whedon off Batgirl is somewhat vindictive for me, as I simply think that Whedon -- as a filmmaker -- is uninspiring and somewhat lazy. I read his awful Wonder Woman script that was rejected back in 2006. We don't need any of that in a Batgirl movie.

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Postby Chuckman » Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:39 pm

I wonder if “I realized I didn’t have a story” means “I couldn’t figure out how to make a police commissioner’s plucky daughter who follows in the footsteps of the world’s greatest detective into a brainwashed killer ballerina who can’t get pregnant.”
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Postby Gob Hobblin » Sat Feb 24, 2018 6:21 pm

It's like...it's right there. The potential for an awesome movie is...right freaking there.

...IT'S RIGHT THERE.

:rageface:
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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:40 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:I wonder if “I realized I didn’t have a story” means “I couldn’t figure out how to make a police commissioner’s plucky daughter who follows in the footsteps of the world’s greatest detective into a brainwashed killer ballerina who can’t get pregnant.”

Nah, it's code for "Can't be inspired to write about a girl who wears boots all the time."

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Postby silvermoonlight » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:17 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:Nah, it's code for "Can't be inspired to write about a girl who wears boots all the time."


I agree with that and that's the issue I have with Joss he thinks in his head he gets women its like he believes his own hype because Buffy was so great in 90's but if you compare Buffy's female lead to the newer media like Star Trek Discovery you realize how much of a rank amateur he is and his writing style has not changed or improved much in the decades since. Black Widow had great potential but after the Avengers movie he did hardly anything with her she kind of felt like she's there because he was going look I gave you a female character I'm so feminist so don't complain now.
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Postby Chuckman » Sun Feb 25, 2018 2:49 pm

It’s extremely telling that all the female Marvel characters see the vast majority of their development in the Cap movies. Black Widow in particular is like a different character between Avengers and Winter Soldier/Civil War.
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