Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby autumnmycat » Wed Mar 29, 2017 8:23 pm

So, I've been rereading the manga in an attempt to solidify a few theories that I have for the Eva universe, and this shot stood out to me.

Image

Has it ever been specifically stated by Satamoto who this girl is? And if he has, what's the interview where he said so? I'm not even sure how I would look it up as this seems to be her only appearance. Some people have been suggesting it's Mari, but without Satamoto's explicit say so, there would be no way to confirm that. What strikes me as odd is that is the way she's the only character (besides Asuka and her mother) in this scene who's face is not shrouded, seemingly implying her importance, yet she doesn't seem to be a reoccurring character. It would make sense thematically that this is an early draft of Mari (considering Stage 60 was released around '04 and the first rebuild didn't come out until '07), but again, this is just my speculation.

If this is actually common knowledge, and I'm being redundant, my apologies. Thanks!

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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:03 pm

Not to my knowledge, she's only really described as that woman's daughter, and presumably is why Asuka was born by IVF in the manga (See towards the end of Stage 24 for that part of the story). Presumably, Kyoko was snubbed by that girl's father for that girl's mother, and Asuka was made to compete with that girl. This could possibly make that other girl Langley's daughter.

But I'm interested in what your theories are. I've always liked hearing people's takes on the series. It's part of why I came to this forum in the first place.
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby Reichu » Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:28 pm

She's just an auxiliary character created for the manga to supplement the altered back-stories, along the same lines as Yui's nephew. No relation to Mari. (Reminds me of the high school-age Ritsuko in episode 21 if anything.)
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby NemZ » Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:46 pm

...Yui's nephew?
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:51 pm

Yui has a nephew?
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby Reichu » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:09 pm

In the manga, Shinji stayed with Yui's older sister and her husband rather than "Sensei". Their son (Yui's nephew, Shinji's cousin) is shown as early as volume three, in a similar way as Asuka's stepsister is -- face fully visible in the panel, while the adults' are partly cut off and their eyes never shown.
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:18 pm

Shit, how could I forget about that. They really are insignificant characters really. I mean, I remember Shinji getting picked up by the cops for stealing a bike in the rain in the manga, but the cousin is like, barely registering.
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby NemZ » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:19 pm

Huh. I have no recollection of this kid.
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby autumnmycat » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:38 pm

View Original PostDarkBluePhoenix wrote:Not to my knowledge, she's only really described as that woman's daughter, and presumably is why Asuka was born by IVF in the manga (See towards the end of Stage 24 for that part of the story). Presumably, Kyoko was snubbed by that girl's father for that girl's mother, and Asuka was made to compete with that girl. This could possibly make that other girl Langley's daughter.

I thought as much after rereading that scene a couple of times, but the line that does bother me is when Asuka's caretaker says, "No, I've heard rumors that wasn't the only reason," which is pretty ominous. Also on y'all's wiki, you have something about Asuka's caretaker looking like Mari, which is a little interesting.

But I'm interested in what your theories are. I've always liked hearing people's takes on the series. It's part of why I came to this forum in the first place.

It's not too crazy, especially since y'all have talked about it on here before. But, it's basically an expanded multiverse where all iterations of Evangelion are possible (not sure how yet, but I do enjoy the idea that it's because they're all separate versions of what could exist after rejecting instrumentality, similiar to what happens at the end of the manga). Also, I think Campus Apocalypse is interesting because it tackles the idea that Gendo is literally hopping universes, an idea that has only kind of, maybe, theoretically been tossed around in the "main canon" and Rebuild. I've still not collected all the info I need to make a succinct point, but I'm getting there.

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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:48 pm

Well, based on the above conversation, even after several read throughs, somethings simply escape the mind, like Yui's nephew and older sibling. And I think that wiki post is more of a "Oh look, that's an interesting similarity" but nonetheless it's still an interesting observation to make.

Ah, multiverse theory. I can't wait too hear (well read I guess) what you come up with.
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby autumnmycat » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:58 pm

My theory is probably not all that original, but I've had a lot of people on Facebook tell me that I'm wrong just because the "manga isn't canon." However, Mari's presence at the end of the manga (even with the insistence from Sadamoto that it's just for fun) really makes me nervous that something more is going on, especially since the Rebuild very much implies timeline/universe repetition. I've just been involved with a lot of multiverses and the Rebuild is setting off alarm bells. (Also, even though Campus Apocalypse is mostly considered "soft canon," the multiverse themes brought up in there are wild.)

As for Yui's nephew, I'll have to reread. It's interesting, though, because that would make the whole "Shikinami/Ayanami/Makinami" dynamic even more poignant.

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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:19 am

Well, those Facebook folks are dead wrong, as the manga is as cannon as the anime and rebuild. Even if Sadamoto did it for fun, the manga still predates the release of the anime. I do hate when people insist it isn't an equal part... it really ticks me off. I love the manga as much as the original anime, and they both offer pretty unique looks at the premise of the show.

Well, EoE and the manga also hint at this. I'm not sure if you've finished the manga or not, but the ending does put that out there in a subtle way.

Also, welcome to the forum ^_^
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby autumnmycat » Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:39 am

Thank you! It's nice to be talking to people who understand the series well since my exposure to it has been in bits and pieces until very recently.

Yes, I have finished the manga, and I own all the omnibuses (I know, I'm a fake fan, I should have the tankobons lmao), but I have only read them once a few months ago, so my memory isn't 100% clear on all of the events, which is why I'm rereading them.

But, yes, I agree with you! I really enjoy the manga, and I think that the differences are slight, but important, especially when the Rebuild is a "Prologue/Beginning," "Break/Middle," "Rush/End" structure and (God permitting we ever get it) 3.0+1.0 is an obvious implication of some type of remixing of the story or even possibly mixing of universes. I just think that retellings of Evangelion are possibly more than just retellings, but to what extent, I don't think we'll know until 3.0+1.0.

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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby Reichu » Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:50 am

"The woman looks like Mari" being on the Wiki just means that one of the few people who have felt like editing the thing lately decided to add that. It doesn't mean it's a particularly meaningful observation. A great deal of Sadamoto's characters look alike, and there is also the matter of pareidolia. I would likely go and remove this comment from the Wiki if I knew where it was.

The manga is canon to itself. No more, no less. The bonus chapter Mari is clearly a colleague of Yui's and in the manga's universe; it has nothing to do with the new films and hoping for some connection will lead to disappointment.

I really feel like the "all parts of X franchise end up being connected in-story somehow" trope is overripe. It was cool the first few times, but eventually its invocation became an obsessive tic, the effect of which is basically an Instrumentality of IP. That is: destroy the poignant beauty of individual stories for the hulking banality of a space-time teratoma (multiverses! time loops! Klein bottles! etc.) where nothing is special and nothing matters.

Knowing Anno, if he's tapping into this stuff in any way, it's to expose the underbelly and then vivisect it to see the ugliness inside, as opposed to providing expectant fans with any kind of gratification.
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:01 am

autumnmycat wrote:Thank you! It's nice to be talking to people who understand the series well since my exposure to it has been in bits and pieces until very recently.

Yes, I have finished the manga, and I own all the omnibuses (I know, I'm a fake fan, I should have the tankobons lmao), but I have only read them once a few months ago, so my memory isn't 100% clear on all of the events, which is why I'm rereading them.

But, yes, I agree with you! I really enjoy the manga, and I think that the differences are slight, but important, especially when the Rebuild is a "Prologue/Beginning," "Break/Middle," "Rush/End" structure and (God permitting we ever get it) 3.0+1.0 is an obvious implication of some type of remixing of the story or even possibly mixing of universes. I just think that retellings of Evangelion are possibly more than just retellings, but to what extent, I don't think we'll know until 3.0+1.0.

I've read it at least six times (four of those for research for my fan fic), and I still can't remember every single detail. The series (anime, rebuild, and manga) has too many minor caveats to remember every single little thing from each of the separate yet equal canons.

Well it would be interesting if that were to be confirmed in Final, we just have to be patient and wait for it to come out and then we'll know for sure.
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Re: Stage 60 Question: New Character?

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Postby silvermoonlight » Sat Apr 01, 2017 5:53 am

View Original Postautumnmycat wrote:My theory is probably not all that original, but I've had a lot of people on Facebook tell me that I'm wrong just because the "manga isn't canon."


I agree with the others the manga is canon I always thought it was one version of how events played out and could ether be one cycle which could be before or after the series or another universe's story of events in the vast multiverse. ^_^
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