Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Fri Dec 16, 2016 10:11 am

Anno explained Noriko's backstory in the first 3 minutes of Episode 1 of Gunbuster, and explored its world building by using the situations of the narrative to engage with the world building in a way that seemed very natural to the flow of the story.

Anno explains the whole lore behind The Secret of Blue Water (a dense one involving millions of years of giant humans and aliens with a god-like ownership over their creation) in under 5 minutes, which ended up all being a simple teaser to the reveal of a talking whale.

Anno explains the lore of NGE in about a minute in EoE.

Anno explains the backstories of all of the characters in Kare Kano in in 30-second increments throughout his involvement in the series.

Anno explains Hiromi Yoshii's motivation in Love & Pop for buying a ring by leading up to it with naturally-flowing character drama, who's relevance wasn't realized in full until the motivation set in.

Anno explains the backstory of Ayako Fujitani's character in Shiki-Jitsu in about 8 minutes of drama and one minute of discussion towards the end of the film.

Anno explains Cutie Honey's origins in just a handful of shots and a voice-over.

Anno turns expositional dialogue into an art form in Shin Godzilla.

I really doubt that Anno is going to suddenly fail now. Not with all of the experience he's had dealing with this very same issue over and over again.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Guy Nacks » Sat Dec 17, 2016 4:03 am

Do sleeping cocks cum? Sometimes.


That is my ultimate answer to this thread's question.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Merkaba » Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:23 pm

View Original PostRay wrote:^You shot first cowboy. :irked:

Again. It's clear this conversation isn't going anywhere until the last movie comes out. Again, done talking about it.


No, you did by bringing up your same (illegitimate) complaints on yet another thread.

I've frequented this site less and less over the last year, in part because of little-to-no new news, and in part because of having to reread tired trash like the stuff you post on every. single. Rebuild. thread.

Please stop.

As for the OP, I absolutely do not think for even a second that Anno regrets the Rebuilds, and I am confident, like most of the others on here, that he will end this series beautifully and to my personal satisfaction. Rebuild is a different beast than NGE, and I love them both for different reasons. Anno should be proud of what he's created - I know I would be if I were him.

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:54 pm

Back to the OP's original question, I don't think Anno regrets anything about the Evangelion franchise inasmuch as he simply doesn't like parts of it. He was on a TV program shortly after he finished the original NGE series where he talked to a bunch of school children, and in it one of the kids asked him if he liked Evangelion. He replied that he liked parts of it and didn't like other parts of it. When the kids asked him which parts he didn't like, Anno replied "The parts where I see myself."

Anno doesn't regret Evangelion. He just doesn't like looking in a mirror. With the new films I think he simply bought a new mirror, maybe one with a fancier frame and a cleaner looking glass, and only found the same face looking back at him.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby LightDragonman » Thu Dec 22, 2016 4:29 am

You know, I'm just gonna through this out there, the explanation that 3.0 was made the way it was in order for the audience to be in the same mindset as Shinji I find to be a terrible excuse. That basically means that the narrative was compromised in order to try to force the viewer to feel a certain way, which doesn;t seem like an even trade.

And for all the talk about how this is Shinji's story overall, it's really hard to relate to a guy who constantly screws up on a massive scale, and who can't catch a break or act for himself without it backfiring because of the overall theme of "anti-escapism" and "facing reality". Maybe the next film will indeed change all that, but for now, I can only judge the story based on where things have been left off in 3.0.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby pwhodges » Thu Dec 22, 2016 4:41 am

View Original PostLightDragonman wrote:That basically means that the narrative was compromised in order to try to force the viewer to feel a certain way,

That implies there was originally a different narrative which was compromised; I see no evidence of that.

it's really hard to relate to a guy who constantly screws up on a massive scale, and who can't catch a break or act for himself without it backfiring because of the overall theme of "anti-escapism" and "facing reality"

That's why we need a film to try to get that across; and for those who are not perfect, relating to someone else not perfect isn't as large a step as you suggest.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby jcmoorehead » Thu Dec 22, 2016 5:24 am

View Original PostLightDragonman wrote:And for all the talk about how this is Shinji's story overall, it's really hard to relate to a guy who constantly screws up on a massive scale, and who can't catch a break or act for himself without it backfiring because of the overall theme of "anti-escapism" and "facing reality".


As you did point out, we only have 3.0 to go on but it's not that when Shinji acts for himself he makes always screws up on a massive scale, it's that when he acts for himself he is doing it for the wrong reasons and he disregards everyone but himself.

I think 2.0 is a bit unfair to call him out at the end because whilst he does disregard everyone's words, except for Misato, he had no idea that was going to happen and the fact that he did manage to get through to Rei kinda vindicates him a bit. He was reckless in that he probably (Well definitely) shouldn't have pushed Evangelion Unit 01 as much as he did. Yet it is somewhat dubious that he is entirely to blame for Third Impact, considering that after credits sequence. I still feel more happened.

In the case of 3.0 we do see Shinji try to act for himself but get selfish towards the end. He bought into the idea of there being a quick fix to the problem despite the warning from Fuyutsuki about rebuilding the world not being so simple. When it comes to grab the spears all the people who are able to tell him to stop, even Kaworu tells him to stop but Shinji continues. It is a message that there isn't always a quick fix to your solution, things can be mended and repaired but it'll take time.

With 3.0 only being the third part of the series we're sort of at the point of the story where the protagonist will be at their lowest. Look at how Shinji was at the start of EoE. His city, destroyed, his friends are gone, the one person who show him any kindness in that time has just been killed by his own hand and Shinji has no one to turn to at all. People talk about how the current Shinji has no chance to get better, EoE Shinji was just as bad. Except EoE Shinji learned the lesson that there is no quick fix to his problem and that there is hope in the world and he accepted it. He learned that the road will be long and bumpy but there is the chance for him to find happiness.

The Shinji we see in 3.0+1.0 can do exactly the same.

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Thu Dec 22, 2016 6:08 pm

Evangelion Q is the only narrative for Evangelion Q. There is no "original" to compromise. It's not like the Eva franchise is known for being clear and simple.

This thread is quickly turning from "Does Anno regret making Rebuild?" to "Do I regret watching Rebuild?" I personally regret nothing within terms of my experience with any of Hideaki Anno's work.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby CommanderFish » Thu Dec 22, 2016 6:25 pm

FreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:This thread is quickly turning from "Does Anno regret making Rebuild?" to "Do I regret watching Rebuild?"

This.
Also I agree with Reichu in that this question really has no use being asked. Maybe later, and with more info, but certainly not now.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Guy Nacks » Thu Dec 22, 2016 9:07 pm

Well, I personally regret that Anno made rebuild because in taking so long to complete it, he's gonna end up keep everyone hanging on the finale...permanently.

I mean, the way things are shaping up in terms of current events, I'm afraid we'll probably all be killed before Final is released.

In hindsight, I wish he had concentrated on more original projects. Whatever became of that Star Trek-like show he was supposedly thinking of doing in the late '90s?
Among the people who use the Internet, many are obtuse. Because they are locked in their rooms, they hang on to that vision which is spreading across the world. But this does not go beyond mere ‘data’. Data without analysis [thinking], which makes you think that you know everything. This complacency is nothing but a trap. Moreover, the sense of values that counters this notion is paralyzed by it.

And so we arrive at demagogy. - Hideaki Anno, 1996

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Geometer » Thu Dec 22, 2016 9:52 pm

I think he may have bit off more than he could chew. I think he may have written Shinji to be in a no-win situation. Everyone else is too underdeveloped to care, I mean maybe if they explained their backstories but I don't see how Anno can do that for Misato, Asuka, Ristuko, and Mari all while finishing Shinji's arc, Rei Q's arc, give some meaningful interaction with Asuka and Misato with Shinji(reconciliation hopefully), and finish the overall narrative.

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby ChaddyManPrime » Fri Dec 23, 2016 2:25 am

I don't think he does, I believe that he has come to New realizations about stuff he's learned about in life and is just applying it to the story of old.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby SEELE-01 » Fri Dec 23, 2016 3:27 am

View Original PostGeometer wrote:I think he may have bit off more than he could chew

Well, he is delivering... Slower than promised but delivering nonetheless...

Since it came to light the number of 2.0 rewrites and the long and troubled production history of Q, I have considered that maybe the whole "I have my own studio and I can do as I please with it" has not helped at all.

He sets deadlines, budget, producers, animations, what goes in and out, writes/rewrites scripts until very advanced production stages... It simply gives me a "The thief and the Cobbler/Richard Williams" feel...
The Tv series may have had abrupt ending and a few loose ends, but the fact that there was someone breathing on his neck to put something out certainly contributed for NGE to be what it is.
IMO, Anno may simply have too much freedom at Khara when it comes to Rebuild's production.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Jinroh » Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:04 am

View Original PostSEELE-01 wrote:Since it came to light the number of 2.0 rewrites and the long and troubled production history of Q

Do you have any articles talking about that?

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Geometer » Fri Dec 23, 2016 11:01 am

View Original PostSEELE-01 wrote:Well, he is delivering... Slower than promised but delivering nonetheless...

Since it came to light the number of 2.0 rewrites and the long and troubled production history of Q, I have considered that maybe the whole "I have my own studio and I can do as I please with it" has not helped at all.

He sets deadlines, budget, producers, animations, what goes in and out, writes/rewrites scripts until very advanced production stages... It simply gives me a "The thief and the Cobbler/Richard Williams" feel...
The Tv series may have had abrupt ending and a few loose ends, but the fact that there was someone breathing on his neck to put something out certainly contributed for NGE to be what it is.
IMO, Anno may simply have too much freedom at Khara when it comes to Rebuild's production.


I would agree that the limitations of the show defiantly helped it. The Rebuilds, or at least 3.0 show signs of creativity overload in my eyes.
I think the best bet for 3.0+1.0 is go to the tv route, not in the sense of a mindscape episode but something that goes off the beaten path, focuses on the characters and ignores the lore/main plot. It would be interesting to see something like a few months of Shinji's life to the point where slowly earns Misato's/Asuka's trust back and they eventually give him another chance. A message of 3.0 seems to be there is no easy and quick ways to fix your problems. I doubt they will go this way for a big budget movie though, and I hope Anno doesn't get pressured into making it like EoE, which I don't think would work in the context of the Rebuilds.

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Lennik » Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:39 pm

I'm kind of baffled by people talking about Q as if it contradicted anything, like they forgot that they were watching Eva and thought the movies were gonna be some "save the sister waifu and to hell with everyone else" power fantasy.

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Fri Dec 23, 2016 10:33 pm

Can this thread be locked?
It's not about Anno anymore.
It's turned into yet another thread where the same five people continue to warp the facts & movies themselves so they adhere to their disappointed opinion of the films.
"I don't like the movies so everyone involved in them must be completely bored & devoid of the passion needed to make them! Blah blah blah."


Eva truly is a story that repeats. In that people with aggrievances repeat the same nonsense again & again instead of just moving on.

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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Reichu » Fri Dec 23, 2016 11:41 pm

The thread was never about Anno, really. Read the actual OP.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby SEELE-01 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 1:29 am

View Original PostJinroh wrote:Do you have any articles talking about that?


Not at hand, but I seem to recall 2.0 went through at least 10 different drafts while in production... Now, different versions and approaches to history are not rare, changing parts of the script while the previous one is far into production is something I label as "troubled".
Q if not troubled (that we know of), was very long...

The CRC details a lot of things that went unused or were scrapped and many of interviews given shed more light into the turmoil of this movies. I remember one that describes that Mari's character and role in the series was decided in a short time span in an hotel room after many variations of the script originated from trying to add her to the story...

Overall, and besides my previous opinion, the fact that Anno didn't seem to have an exact idea of what he wanted to do when he decided to make Rebuild is also a problem; "re-making Evangelion with new animation, characters and ending" is not exact enough. If Khara were not his to manage, I doubt any studio would have given green light to make the Rebuild series without at least complete scripts for all movies.
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Re: Do you think anno regrets making rebuild?

Postby Apox » Sat Dec 24, 2016 2:27 am

View Original PostSEELE-01 wrote:Overall, and besides my previous opinion, the fact that Anno didn't seem to have an exact idea of what he wanted to do when he decided to make Rebuild is also a problem; "re-making Evangelion with new animation, characters and ending" is not exact enough. If Khara were not his to manage, I doubt any studio would have given green light to make the Rebuild series without at least complete scripts for all movies.


I think this is a great example of what I was trying to get out. The rebuilds feel like anno decided he needed money to do other things, so he wrote down a bunch of ideas on a napkin and decided to make some movies (he kinda eluded to this). I truly believe anno is at his worst when there is no one to reign him in and keep him in check. If this was the case I doubt that the gap between the rebuilds would be so large or the narrative so disjointed.


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