Ok, this has been a rather frustrating discussion. I was hoping to get some sort of consent and narrow down the options with the help of everyone. Instead, everyone seemed to have their unique own different preferences. It helped, however, in giving me more time and perspectives to think, but In the end, this will have to be my own personal choice, I'm the one doing the subs after all. I do appreciate all of you for help.
Most of the parts regarding speculation I unfortunately disagree with your views. I won't spend time debating with you the idiosyncrasies of the third impact anymore. I'll now just give a final consideration of my own on specific points that Interfere with the understanding of SOL and TOL and the line in question, but I won't debate them anymore. I appreciate if we could just agree in disagree and let the issue end, of course if there is something you really feel you must say to conclude everything, please go ahead.
Bagheera wrote:I am not sure such a thing [original TOL] exists. (...) [Or that it and the far create souls]
I'm 90% sure it does since Unit 01 is a clone of Lilith, the Lance is the original, the Souls had to come from somewhere and are NOT SELF SPONTANEOUS in the Eva verse, and that Fuyutsuki used the word "restore". I'll further elaborate it later on the post when answering Reich. Unless you ring some new evidence and breathtaking brilliant argument, this matter is pretty much closed by me.
Bagheera wrote:To me the Embryo of Life is metaphorical [to seed of life]
referring to the fact that Yui/Unit 01 is being transformed into a Seed/Source of Life.
I completely disagree. Your logic makes no sense. A doctor still calls himself a doctor even after he is retired or even post-mortis by others simply by the importance he had when he was an ACTIVE doctor. It's a title. A Nurse is not a Medic, they work in the same area but have different functions and formations. "Seed of Life" is a specific title designating the transporters of eggs full of souls. Unit 01 has never been a Seed of Life because it never was "transported", never had an Egg of souls and never will. Yui never was and never will become one such Seed of Life, in the specific meaning the term has in the series. Your interpretation goes against the pretty clear definition given by Misato herself or even NGE2. A closed issue for me.
My main objection to this is that it[embryo of souls] doesn't convey anything to the viewer, and that I feel it creates needless confusion by being overly tied to the concept of the Tree of Life in Judaic mythology. "Embryo of Life" is both accurate and meaningful,
Wait, what? "embryo of souls" is less meaningful that "embryo of life"? I have to strongly disagree. At least me, Reichu and Pwhodges agree that "embryo of life" makes no sense. Whatever sense you have taken out of it, was surely pure speculation of your part, the term by itself is near MEANINGLESS.
Reichu wrote:I don't necessarily agree with Bagheera's interpretation of the phrase, but I too am wary about transforming it beyond recognition. "Embryo", for instance, is much more evocative than the already overused "source", as it paints a clear image of something alive that is capable of developing into a more mature form.
"Souls", on the other hand, is much more specific than inochi, particularly in the context of Eva, where they are a known quantity and not just a vague metaphysical concept.
"Embryo of (a) life", then, refers to Eva-01's potential for transforming into this new Singular Being.
I explicitly said that I didn't want to alter "embryo". Only pwhodges wants to alter it with source, which I disagree since it shifts the meaning too much and overlap with "minamoto" when Fuyutsuki refers to the Egg of Lilith just earlier. My only problem is with "LIFE". I thought I was pretty clear about that.
Regarding the specificity of “souls” vs “life”, I think is not a bad alteration. I disagree that “embryo of LIFE” refers to Unit 01 becoming god, It hardly makes sense, I believe "embryo of LIVES" refer to the exclusive ability of the TOL to create life, (souls) from NOTHING. I believe it refers to the function and ability of the Tree of Life, which is generating life, or better yet: HUMAN LIVES: SOULS. Considering the metaphysical meaning is a stretch.
As we are well aware, souls are very special entities that can't be created by man or even SoL. There is a finite number of Souls in the Chamber of Guf, and the one responsible for creating them, is the Tree of Life or god itself.
It's important to understand that The Tree of Life is described in the Talmud as BOTH THE SPIRITUAL PATH TO GOD, as well as THE ENTITY RESPONSIBLE IN CREATING SOULS AND PUTTING THEM INTO THE GUF.
They are the manifestation of god itself. God, in old Judaic Mythology, is much differently from the Christian god, it is very impersonal and much more spiritual, with its manifestations affecting every elements of the Talmud.
it recently occurred to me that this whole Tree of Life business might actually refer to Eva-01's status as the ultimate recipient of humanity's complemented souls (something that is made a bit more clear in NGE2). The Tree of Life presents the path by which humanity can "unify with god" -- which, here, means becoming one within a vessel that is equivalent to a god.
Something which I totally agree, since the Tree of Life is the complete merge of both Fruits, giving humanity's knowledge direct access to the infinite power of the S2 engine. I have theorized that this is what "god" was in the Evaverse, The Tree of Life itself, even before I started lurking Evageeks back in 2004, was one of my earliest theories.
Reichu wrote:Fuyutsuki's assertion that Eva-01 is being "reduced" to them. The Spear of Longinus has been added to the mix, so how on Earth is the result reductive rather than, er, productive? And I'm pretty sure Eva-01 has never been core-fucked by the Spear of Longinus to make a big fancy red tree before.
I never had a problem with that. For me, it was always obvious that he wasn't referring literally to Unit 01, as it's obvious that Unit 01 is a new entity that never had another form unless you consider it ORIGINATED FROM LILITH. It now strikes me, after realizing that in the Judaic Mythology there are MULTIPLE TREE OF LIFES, not a single one, that EVERY SEED OF LIFE IN EVA could have been a Tree of Life seeding their own eggs when their Lances separated from them back in the Eden. If every Seed of Life have their own lance, and Unit 01 (Lilith) merging with Adam's lance becomes a Tree of Life, then this was always a purpose and function of the Lance of Longinus: To form Trees of Life.
Every SoL could have been equal to god, a Tree of Life.
Anyway, I'm almost closing it all down to "embryo of souls". The translation note may be enough to clear up any lost ambiguity by explaining that the original term was "inochi".