Possibly bad news for Shin?

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby LightDragonman » Thu Feb 18, 2016 5:55 am

Wow, if that's not a sign of contempt for the audience, then I don't know what is. If true, then that just makes me hate the Godzilla film even more.

And heck, I wouldn't be surprised if after he finishes Godzilla Resurgence, he continues to push Eva back while he goes off to work on other things, and ultimately never finishes it.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby jcmoorehead » Thu Feb 18, 2016 6:10 am

View Original PostLightDragonman wrote:Wow, if that's not a sign of contempt for the audience, then I don't know what is. If true, then that just makes me hate the Godzilla film even more.

And heck, I wouldn't be surprised if after he finishes Godzilla Resurgence, he continues to push Eva back while he goes off to work on other things, and ultimately never finishes it.


You make it sound like he alone is working on the project, like the entirety of Evangelion has been just Anno sat in an office doing everything. We already know that work has been going on with the final film. EvaMonkey confirmed it. It's been slow and it has been frustrating but so what? There is other media out there to consume while we wait.

I know it's a different type of industry but I work in the games industry, I've been on the other side of a frustrating delay for people. I've seen people complain about how long it has taken for the product and information to come out. It was hard seeing those complaints but there was nothing that could be done, things happen.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Reichu » Thu Feb 18, 2016 6:31 am

View Original PostLightDragonman wrote:Wow, if that's not a sign of contempt for the audience, then I don't know what is.

If your attitude isn't a sign of needing more passions and hobbies in one's life, I don't know what is.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby pwhodges » Thu Feb 18, 2016 6:50 am

View Original PostLightDragonman wrote:He made a commitment to the series, so he does sort of have an obligation to finish it. Obviously not during a depressed time in his life, but not to the point where he puts it off for who knows when.

He's doing no more, and over no longer a period, than Wagner did when his work on The Ring stalled, and he went off and wrote a couple of other operas instead. The Ring still ended up as a masterpiece.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby TheFriskyIan » Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:03 pm

He himself wants to finish Eva, but forcing yourself to work on something instead of letting it come naturally is gonna make the project fall flat.

View Original PostLightDragonman wrote:He made a commitment to the series, so he does sort of have an obligation to finish it. Obviously not during a depressed time in his life, but not to the point where he puts it off for who knows when.


There was a link somewhere that goes to a college student questioning Anno on the status of Final when he was at an event on animation and he already stated the rough draft for the story in complete. I doubt it will be much longer for the touch ups to the story will be completed after Anno is done with Godzilla. Expect more news on Final within the year.

Heck, the way he's handled this whole thing is also really frustrating to me. He leaves 3.33 on an extremely bitter and depressing cliffhanger, then removes the next film's release date, goes for a whole year without giving any sort of update, and then announces three years after the film was released that the movie still won't be finished for a while because he is off filming a guy in a rubber suit. I'm sorry, but that sort of behavior doesn't get a free pass from me, even if I can understand why he'd want to take a break. Saying something will be ready "when it's done" just feels like an excuse to not work on it and to put it off for as long as possible while you go off to work on other things.


Look, I of all people am not a fan of how Q dropped the ball with its story just to get Shinji into the same spot he was in at the end of episode 24, but I'm pretty sure we would have gotten the same situation with the story whether these movies were released closer together or longer apart (instead of the Q movie that never was, but I'm sure that's bound to be brought up whenever Khara finally decides to release the CRC).

Again, in the five years that it will most likely end up taking for the film to be released, I've seen other franchises expand and grow, have had to deal with personal loss and maturity, and seen the world change and other things that I enjoy grow and change over time. But not this story. Shinji is still in the same pit of despair and hopelessness, along with the rest of the characters, since 2012.


Don't fall for the hype effect. It's kills every title in every form of media that has long development times.

Not to mention that with how long this film has been put off, it will have to end up being nothing short of a masterpiece for it to justify all these delays. If it isn't, then I'm probably gonna swear off watching anything Anno puts out.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Sicarius VI » Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:45 pm

I'd say we need to give 2016 a chance to show us something first. It's only been less than two months at this point, we still have 10 or so in this year.

Someone posted it, and I agreed, they said something on the lines of -2016 will be the start on rising the curtain around Final- or something like that. I still believe it is.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Thu Feb 18, 2016 10:35 pm

Good things come to those who wait.....


and wait....


and wait....


and wait....

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby cyharding » Thu Feb 18, 2016 10:41 pm

View Original PostTheFriskyIan wrote:(instead of the Q movie that never was, but I'm sure that's bound to be brought up whenever Khara finally decides to release the CRC).

I thought that was a unproven theory.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby hui43210 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:27 pm

View Original Postcyharding wrote:I thought that was a unproven theory.


It is, mostly from people who don't like 3.0.
Is the 3.0 spoiler policy gone?.... Cool, then I'm nominating myself as EvaGeeks 1# Sakura Suzuhara fan/nerd.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:31 pm

It's all based on people making assumptions on what the next movie will be based off the stupid post-credit teasers. Those teasers are the only thing I truly hate in the Rebuild franchise. They're clearly made on the fly at the end of production based off of ideas sketched out on a napkin & it's only there to pay homage to the TV series.

Then the fans take those 30 second teasers as gospel and lose their minds when "that thing I liked in the teaser wasn't in the final movie!" I have to figure that's why the teaser for Final wasn't a series of clips from different scenes but just a rough schematic of a central action sequence that in some way will certainly make it into the film.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Yaywalter » Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:31 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:If your attitude isn't a sign of needing more passions and hobbies in one's life, I don't know what is.


I thought his avatar was the giveaway on that one.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby TheFriskyIan » Sat Feb 20, 2016 12:06 am

You can not make this argument when we've only ever gotten three, one of which was pretty accurate, and another is for a movie that isn't even out yet.

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote: They're clearly made on the fly at the end of production based off of ideas sketched out on a napkin & it's only there to pay homage to the TV series.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sat Feb 20, 2016 3:21 pm

Unless Khara is making the Rebuild films in a manner completely unlike how ALL films - aside from special occasions like The Lord of the Rings where everything enters physical production at once - are made then I'm confident in the belief that the teasers mean nothing & should be ignored.

I make that argument because I know how films are made professionally from first hand experience. You shouldn't promise what's coming next when you don't have a script because all you do is set up expectations and create fodder for speculation. Marvel has perfected the teaser game because the films they're teasing are normally in post production when the teasers are shot so they know what they're selling. The teasers in Rebuild are just homages to the show.

If the teasers were actually indicative of what to expect in the films then we would have been getting a new Rebuild every year as opposed to every couple years. A proper teaser signifies a set story and

Absolutely nothing in the teasers makes it into the final films as is. Actually, very little in any of the teasers has actually played out in the films marketed. Most of what the teaser for 2.0 got right was simply because those were broad moments transported directly from the pre-existing TV series. Eva Unit 02 arrives with a redheaded pilot, Eva Unit 03 gets corrupted, Eva Unit 04 blows up; all things that were pretty much a certainty as long as they kept the story following the TV series. The only unique things the teaser gets right are that the film starts with an action scene featuring Unit 05 - something I'm sure Anno had settled on early in production - that Eva Unit 06 would come down from the moon - something set up at the end of the first film - and that there would be a new girl - something that was so heavily promoted in early marketing that it was a given. Everything else in the teaser is old footage from the series just dropped in to fill a time slot. Hell, they use a shot from when Asuka fights Zeurel and in the final film she's out of the picture by that point.

Nothing in the 3.0 teaser makes it into the film because they didn't have a script when they finished the second film. I'm sure Anno had the broad strokes down - Shinji feels bad, Shinji puts all his faith in Kaworu (something taken from the series), we find out Rei's a clone - but the rest wasn't there. Instead he had an IDEA of where the film could go, a story that includes Eva Unit 08 being quickened, Gendo & Fuyutsuki hanging out with a donkey, Rei & Mari having a private conference, Kaji pulling a gun on someone, etc - but they didn't have a script. Then when Anno started the script new ideas had come to him and instead of following some ideas that were loosely sketched out while finishing one film he started fresh and followed his own intuition. It's a big reason why I'm sure they learned their lesson from the 3.0 teaser and that's why the teaser for Final is just shots of an action scene that most likely will be in the actual film. There's no shots of the characters and everything Misato says is too vague to read into.

The teasers mean nothing because films are made over spans of YEARS. Not weeks. When Christopher Nolan directed Batman Begins the original plan was for Film 2 to have the Joker take over the city and then Film 3 was going to be the Joker scarring Harvey Dent and Batman got in a war between Joker and Two-Face. That sure didn't happen. Because the narrative between films is fluid (plus Heath Ledger died).

The teasers are dumb. They mean nothing. They're quickly made - visually they've all been of a much rougher quality then what has been in the feature films they are attached too - and they feel scrounged together. Like the silly mid-film "Commercial Break" eyecatch things in the films, the teasers exist as nothing more then a homage to the TV series.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby TheFriskyIan » Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:54 pm

Everything above this quote was an opinion.

You're contradicting yourself in this post. You say nothing made it to the film then go on to talk about how everything made it to the film, it's reference to the TV series means absolutely nothing when everything we saw at the end of 1.0 appeared in 2.0. And no, the new character was only mentioned in discussions about Rebuild, no one actually saw any new characters until Mari's appearance at the end of 1.0, there was no marketing for it until after 2.0 started its campaigning before the theatrical release.

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:Absolutely nothing in the teasers makes it into the final films as is. Actually, very little in any of the teasers has actually played out in the films marketed. Most of what the teaser for 2.0 got right was simply because those were broad moments transported directly from the pre-existing TV series. Eva Unit 02 arrives with a redheaded pilot, Eva Unit 03 gets corrupted, Eva Unit 04 blows up; all things that were pretty much a certainty as long as they kept the story following the TV series. The only unique things the teaser gets right are that the film starts with an action scene featuring Unit 05 - something I'm sure Anno had settled on early in production - that Eva Unit 06 would come down from the moon - something set up at the end of the first film - and that there would be a new girl - something that was so heavily promoted in early marketing that it was a given. Everything else in the teaser is old footage from the series just dropped in to fill a time slot. Hell, they use a shot from when Asuka fights Zeurel and in the final film she's out of the picture by that point.


We have zero information on Q's development process because as I said at the beginning, we lack a CRC. We have no idea whether those scenes were part of the time gap, immediately after 2.0, or were part of a different branching idea completely. But if what you say is true and that 1.0 and 3.0 should have accurate NTPs it's only going to look extra stupid to have this one that will never ever have anything to do with the story and Khara making zero statements about it. Years from now, people will watch these movies for the first time and wonder about this, and no the first conclusion isn't going to be "Well maybe they just didn't mean it!"

Nothing in the 3.0 teaser makes it into the film because they didn't have a script when they finished the second film. I'm sure Anno had the broad strokes down - Shinji feels bad, Shinji puts all his faith in Kaworu (something taken from the series), we find out Rei's a clone - but the rest wasn't there. Instead he had an IDEA of where the film could go, a story that includes Eva Unit 08 being quickened, Gendo & Fuyutsuki hanging out with a donkey, Rei & Mari having a private conference, Kaji pulling a gun on someone, etc - but they didn't have a script. Then when Anno started the script new ideas had come to him and instead of following some ideas that were loosely sketched out while finishing one film he started fresh and followed his own intuition. It's a big reason why I'm sure they learned their lesson from the 3.0 teaser and that's why the teaser for Final is just shots of an action scene that most likely will be in the actual film. There's no shots of the characters and everything Misato says is too vague to read into.


This has nothing to do with anything, The batman movies didn't have a preview at the end of each movie.

The teasers mean nothing because films are made over spans of YEARS. Not weeks. When Christopher Nolan directed Batman Begins the original plan was for Film 2 to have the Joker take over the city and then Film 3 was going to be the Joker scarring Harvey Dent and Batman got in a war between Joker and Two-Face. That sure didn't happen. Because the narrative between films is fluid (plus Heath Ledger died).


They're there to give the viewer a direction on where the story is headed. If the preview didn't mean anything they would have made all future releases of 2.22 come with the an updated preview akin to either the NTV Roadshow or Eva Extra 08. But they chose not to. Just because you personally don't like them doesn't mean there's no point to them, otherwise they wouldn't even be in there, and I doubt Anno added them just cause they were in NGE.

The teasers are dumb. They mean nothing. They're quickly made - visually they've all been of a much rougher quality then what has been in the feature films they are attached too - and they feel scrounged together. Like the silly mid-film "Commercial Break" eyecatch things in the films, the teasers exist as nothing more then a homage to the TV series.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:32 pm

You're wrong and are allowed to be wrong.
And that's okay.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby TheFriskyIan » Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:01 pm

Kk, come back when you have ground to stand on.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:24 pm

One of us has personal hands on experience with film production AND the actual films have a proven history of being pretty loose in regards to sticking to the post-credit teasers. The studio even cut the teaser at the end of 3.33 when it aired on Japanese TV in September 2014 & replaced it with just the title Evangelion 3.0 + 1.0 on a white background. Guess the all-important teaser might not mean that much in the scheme of things anymore.

The other just plays the lengthy quote & response game so they reiterate how they wish things were.

I feel pretty confident about the ground I stand on. So I'm done here. Good night.

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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby TheFriskyIan » Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:33 pm

Yeah, big talk to sit there and bark all this experience with no back up to it.

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:One of us has personal hands on experience with film production AND the actual films have a proven history of being pretty loose in regards to sticking to the post-credit teasers.


Or maybe they did that since everyone has been clamoring for an update and they wanted to give something instead of just going dark? No clearly it's whatever answer you want it to be.

The studio even cut the teaser at the end of 3.33 when it aired on Japanese TV in September 2014 & replaced it with just the title Evangelion 3.0 + 1.0 on a white background. Guess the all-important teaser might not mean that much in the scheme of things anymore.


So instead of addressing any point I made you just brush it all off with "I'm right you're wrong and I don't need proof"?

Whatever wrongly helps you sleep at night. The only thing done is your pathetic argument.

The other just plays the lengthy quote & response game so they reiterate how they wish things were.

I feel pretty confident about the ground I stand on. So I'm done here. Good night.
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby Bagheera » Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:55 pm

View Original PostTheFriskyIan wrote:Yeah, big talk to sit there and bark all this experience with no back up to it.


He's right, though. That is how films are made. Going all internet tough guy on him isn't gonna change that. Assuming a teaser means anything when the movie is years out and likely doesn't even have a script yet is silly, and we have Q as incontrovertible proof of that. What is there to even talk about here in light of that?
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Re: Possibly bad news for Shin?

Postby TheFriskyIan » Sat Feb 20, 2016 10:25 pm

Asking for someone to actually argue the points one brings up and show proof of their "experience in the industry" should not make that individual an internet tough guy. if someone is gonna talk down to me, I'll gladly scoot to their level. After all, I didn't start any hostilities, I was only met with them.

View Original PostBagheera wrote:He's right, though. That is how films are made. Going all internet tough guy on him isn't gonna change that.


The fact that we have zero idea of the development process of Q? The fact that 1.0's NTP was spot on accurate (a point that GP contradicted himself on)? The fact that one shouldn't use their subjective claim "I don't like the NTP's!" as a dismissal for discussion on the NTP? It doesn't make sense from a story telling stand point to leave footage in a film that has zero relevance to the story itself, none what so ever. If it was a trailer that was shown on TV or the internet and then removed this might be a different story, but keeping this controversial footage in the films years afterwards, knowing it will spark a lot of questions and not editing them out? Seems like too big of an oversight for a legitimate studio like Khara.

Assuming a teaser means anything when the movie is years out and likely doesn't even have a script yet is silly, and we have Q as incontrovertible proof of that. What is there to even talk about here in light of that?
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