If Mari and Asuka are/were Gay. . .

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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Re: If Mari and Asuka are/were Gay. . .

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Postby Sachi » Wed Sep 19, 2018 11:54 am

The book appears in the film, when Shinji goes searching through Nerv's old library to find something for Rei. Probably bears significance of some kind. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hap ... ther_Tales
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Re: If Mari and Asuka are/were Gay. . .

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:22 pm

Directors often slyly telegraph their philosophical or thematic inspirations with book placement on film. Heck, even less-than-stellar filmmakers do that, like that Snyder/Goyer collab for Man of Steel.

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Re: If Mari and Asuka are/were Gay. . .

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Postby manuel ikari » Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:53 pm

View Original PostBlockio wrote:So, according to you, someone can only care about one single person at a time and has no emotional connection to anybody else? With all due respect, thats a bunch of bullsh*t. If I was in a relationship with someone, I would still care about close friends I haven't heard of in a decade, especially if they are in danger (like literally anyone is in Q, constantly). Your entire argumentation boils down to "Asuka cares about Shinji, therefore she cannot care about Mari. I ask you once again, and once again not meaning to insult you, but have you ever actually observed social interactions between real people? .


So, Asuka still is bitter about the 9th angel incident. Given what Shinji did to save Rei from the 10th, understandable. But you still have to bring up a single piece of actual evidence, why Asuka and Mari can't possibly have feelings for each other. Or why "Shikinami comes from Sōryū, therefore it can not be bisexual."

Try this one on for size: Mari wants Shinji to save Asuka because she knows that she might not be able to one day?


And what exactly does that book have to do with Eva? On top of your comparison being more than just a bit of a stretch, trying to force a character into an archetype based on two sentences.


if you contradict me so much, show me your evidence

"Do not turn Asuka into something that is not"

I showed you official evidence and not inventing anything:

In the 2.22 CRC production book, they make it clear that Mari was initially created for commercial purposes.

Initially she was supposed to even kiss Shinji. Now we already have concept art for 3.0 + 1.0 with her quarters with Asuka being split into two because Asuka simply does not want to share anything with her and refuses to spend time with her.

My strongest arguments are the dialogues of the movies:

Asuka's look after Shinji saves her in space. Or listen to what Mari says: "Did you go to see him?" Always Mari pushes Shinji to save her, after the same Asuka tells Shinji "why did not you come to save me?"

Dude, changes in these characters, especially in a work centered around a message like Eva, happen for a reason. These reasons are foreshadowed and all have a thematic purpose. None of the changes we've seen so far support any reason whatsoever for Asuka being paired with Mari.

we have not seen any indication that Asuka is in love with mari (mari is only the replacement of Hikari Horaki)

Asuka and Shinji tinen history and background in the series

As I mentioned before, Shikinami comes from Soryù

In the rebuilds there is also little history but there is (apart from Asuka x mari who has nothing)


Now, what are my reasons for thinking that Asuka feel something for Shinji?

A series of events or situations or reactions of Asuka:


1) Asuka introduces himself to Shinji as a dominant superior person, and throws him to the ground, and immediately "gets over" him. (Yes, it is a reference to sex in case they did not understand it).


2) She has constant fights with Shinji, which is interpreted by her friends as marital fights (this observation of Touji and Kensuke towards them, is repeated in almost all the alternate universes of Evangelion).


3) Asuka, protects the food that Shinji prepared for her, showing Hikari (her best friend at school) that she would not share her food.

Immediately Asuka notices that Shinji also prepares food for Rei that same day, then Asuka gives Hikari "the leftovers" from her lunch (prepared by Shnji).


4), Asuka cooks, while she thinks if the taste of her food would please Shinji. And is surprised by Misato who infers to know that she is in love with Shinji. (because he is cooking).

Like it or not, Mari does not symbolize Kaworu, it's just stuffed with fanservice for hentai lovers.

Show me evidence where Mari insinuates Asuka, or where there is a kiss from the two of them.
Meanwhile, do not write stupid things.

The relationship of Shinji and Asuka is the same both in the series and in the movies, it is always repeated whether you like it or not
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Re: If Mari and Asuka are/were Gay. . .

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Postby Blockio » Thu Sep 20, 2018 4:39 am

View Original Postmanuel ikari wrote:if you contradict me so much, show me your evidence

"Do not turn Asuka into something that is not"

I showed you official evidence and not inventing anything:

In the 2.22 CRC production book, they make it clear that Mari was initially created for commercial purposes.

Initially she was supposed to even kiss Shinji. Now we already have concept art for 3.0 + 1.0 with her quarters with Asuka being split into two because Asuka simply does not want to share anything with her and refuses to spend time with her.
Bwahahahaha you call that evidence? :pointup: Buddy, all of your oh so great "evidence" is AsuShin fanwanking based on sources with questionable meaning at best.

Dude, changes in these characters, especially in a work centered around a message like Eva, happen for a reason. These reasons are foreshadowed and all have a thematic purpose. None of the changes we've seen so far support any reason whatsoever for Asuka being paired with Mari.

we have not seen any indication that Asuka is in love with mari (mari is only the replacement of Hikari Horaki)

Asuka and Shinji tinen history and background in the series

As I mentioned before, Shikinami comes from Soryù

In the rebuilds there is also little history but there is (apart from Asuka x mari who has nothing)
LMFAO this is even better than I thought it would be. How the hell did you come to that conclusion? Tell me, I am genuinely interested how someone can miss a point THAT far.

1) Asuka introduces himself to Shinji as a dominant superior person, and throws him to the ground, and immediately "gets over" him. (Yes, it is a reference to sex in case they did not understand it).
Waitwhat? You are telling me that Asuka/Shinji was love at first sight or something?

2) She has constant fights with Shinji, which is interpreted by her friends as marital fights (this observation of Touji and Kensuke towards them, is repeated in almost all the alternate universes of Evangelion).
Not only confirmation bias, but 90% of this "evidence" comes from spinoffs that noone shouzld ever take as canon. Noone. Ever.

3) Asuka, protects the food that Shinji prepared for her, showing Hikari (her best friend at school) that she would not share her food.

Immediately Asuka notices that Shinji also prepares food for Rei that same day, then Asuka gives Hikari "the leftovers" from her lunch (prepared by Shnji).


4), Asuka cooks, while she thinks if the taste of her food would please Shinji. And is surprised by Misato who infers to know that she is in love with Shinji. (because he is cooking).

Once again, only evidence that Asuka has emotions for Shinji BEFORE the timeskip. NOTHING on after the timeskip (apart from her memories to before it), and, excuse my choice of words, no. Fucking. Evidence. Whatsoever. That she doesn't have emotions for Mari.

Like it or not, Mari does not symbolize Kaworu, it's just stuffed with fanservice for hentai lovers.
So, then what's the point of including her at all? And don't you say "commercial intent" just because there is one guy at Khara who may or may not have said that at one point - do you really believe that Anno would allow something into his masterpiece that doesn't have significance? If so, answer me one question. Don't even bother with replying to anything else: Why of all things would it take him so long to release the final movie, if he didn't cefully look over every single step in production, make sure that everything was just the way he wants it to be?
Face it, Mari is there for a reason, and Mari is there to stay.
The relationship of Shinji and Asuka is the same both in the series and in the movies, it is always repeated whether you like it or not
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I think I see what the *true* problem here is: You refuse to accept that Rebuild != NGE and lash out at anything that threatens your favorite pairing from the series. What did you say about shippers again?
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ sadly not Mari in Q (Joseki)

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Re: If Mari and Asuka are/were Gay. . .

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Postby manuel ikari » Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:07 pm

View Original PostBlockio wrote:Bwahahahaha you call that evidence? :pointup: Buddy, all of your oh so great "evidence" is AsuShin fanwanking based on sources with questionable meaning at best.

LMFAO this is even better than I thought it would be. How the hell did you come to that conclusion? Tell me, I am genuinely interested how someone can miss a point THAT far.

Waitwhat? You are telling me that Asuka/Shinji was love at first sight or something?

Not only confirmation bias, but 90% of this "evidence" comes from spinoffs that noone shouzld ever take as canon. Noone. Ever.


Once again, only evidence that Asuka has emotions for Shinji BEFORE the timeskip. NOTHING on after the timeskip (apart from her memories to before it), and, excuse my choice of words, no. Fucking. Evidence. Whatsoever. That she doesn't have emotions for Mari.

So, then what's the point of including her at all? And don't you say "commercial intent" just because there is one guy at Khara who may or may not have said that at one point - do you really believe that Anno would allow something into his masterpiece that doesn't have significance? If so, answer me one question. Don't even bother with replying to anything else: Why of all things would it take him so long to release the final movie, if he didn't cefully look over every single step in production, make sure that everything was just the way he wants it to be?
Face it, Mari is there for a reason, and Mari is there to stay.

I think I see what the *true* problem here is: You refuse to accept that Rebuild != NGE and lash out at anything that threatens your favorite pairing from the series. What did you say about shippers again?



friend you have your opinion and respect, but you and I know that the end of 4.0 will be the same as seen in ToE

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Re: If Mari and Asuka are/were Gay. . .

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Postby Settie » Sat Sep 22, 2018 6:36 pm

So, then what's the point of including her at all? And don't you say "commercial intent" just because there is one guy at Khara who may or may not have said that at one point - do you really believe that Anno would allow something into his masterpiece that doesn't have significance? If so, answer me one question. Don't even bother with replying to anything else: Why of all things would it take him so long to release the final movie, if he didn't cefully look over every single step in production, make sure that everything was just the way he wants it to be?
Face it, Mari is there for a reason, and Mari is there to stay.


Just wanted to mention a quick thing. Not everything in Eva has to have significance, from the more general fanservice to OG NGEs religious symbolism that didn't really have some deep meaning beyond a visual representation to what instrumentality was. So thinking something has to have some deeper significance is looking for something may not be there. Mari may end up just "being there" with no real relevance to how things turn out, and that in a sense would bring the whole "Mari destroying eva" to a new light. Evas is about its complex characters and what could be more anti-eva than a character that is just there providing some exposition and jiggling and nyaaing every once in a while.

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Postby Shinji Ikari Expy » Sun Sep 23, 2018 10:22 am

I agree with the above post, which is why I don't feel strongly either way about Mari. She is there mainly for comic relief and to move the plot along at certain points, e.g. taking Asuka's place in the Zeruel fight. She's funny and irreverent, sometimes borders on Mary Sue-ish, but not obnoxiously so. It's weird how many angry reactions she gets from fans.

I don't see any evidence that Asuka and Mari are anything more than friends and colleagues, but I guess you can't rule it out. The best argument against it is that in 3.0, Asuka still seems hung up on Shinji and Mari seems to be trying to push them together.

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Postby Akko » Thu Oct 04, 2018 6:10 pm

As much as I Iove the pairing, I think it would be one sided... We can have an scenario where Mari falls in love with Asuka but in time, she starts to realize that Asuka may not feel the same way... but eh, with 14 years in between you can't be really sure what to expect

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:01 pm

^ How about comradery that looks from the outside to be sexual tension/innuendo?
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Postby Akko » Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:13 pm

^ I really want to say yes but it feels... shallow... and tasteless

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Postby Blockio » Wed Oct 17, 2018 12:57 pm

View Original PostDarkBluePhoenix wrote:^ How about comradery that looks from the outside to be sexual tension/innuendo?

From the few scenes we have seen it could be both... real life comrades usually are very relaxed talking about sexuality, including teasing like Mari did. But again, too little seen for a definitive answer
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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:05 pm

View Original PostBlockio wrote:From the few scenes we have seen it could be both... real life comrades usually are very relaxed talking about sexuality, including teasing like Mari did. But again, too little seen for a definitive answer

That was exactly my point, but you're very right, unless they show us more of their relationship, we won't really ever know for sure.Then again, considering its EVA, relationships aren't really ever at the forefront of the plot.

Akko wrote:I really want to say yes but it feels... shallow... and tasteless

It's not really shallow, just a realistic possibility ^_^
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Postby ShonHam » Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:33 am

I don't think it would be a make-or-break aspect of my enjoyment of the Rebuild series honestly, I'd be indifferent for the most part. Although the loss of the "romantic" dynamic between Shinji and Asuka due to a change in character writing would slightly irk me.
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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Sun Nov 11, 2018 9:38 pm

^ Well, so many of us love the Shinji x Asuka angle of things, it does make it a little... weird without it.
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Postby ShonHam » Thu Nov 22, 2018 6:28 am

View Original PostDarkBluePhoenix wrote:^ Well, so many of us love the Shinji x Asuka angle of things, it does make it a little... weird without it.


It'd definitely effect many people's enjoyment or thoughts on the rebuilds, although I stand by that it wouldn't be something I'd be completely against. Anno and co. will do what they want with the story and characters, but I'd frankly leave Shinji and Asuka's connection be without any new wild cards.
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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:03 pm

^ By wild cards, do you mean Mari?
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Postby ShonHam » Sun Nov 25, 2018 5:52 am

Just unintentional wording on my part, but she is partly what I was referring to. I think that the vast majority of fans don't want to see Asuka in a relationship with any other cast member besides Shinji, Mari included.
I don't think they'll have time to develop or make anything out of it, but I think the only way that they could make the Asuka x Mari thing an interesting idea is if Asuka was left vulnerable and lonely due to Shinji's absence and Mari over time seemed to fill that void. Scenes bridging the gap between 2.0 and 3.0 would be nice.
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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:44 pm

^ An entire movie set between 2.0 and 3.0 would be nice. I'd like to know what happened to Kaji, and when everything went straight to hell for NERV, and when WILLE was founded among other things.
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Postby BlueBasilisk » Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:48 am

View Original PostDarkBluePhoenix wrote:^ Well, so many of us love the Shinji x Asuka angle of things, it does make it a little... weird without it.

I like Asuka/Shinji in NGE buy not in the film series because all of the scenes and developing character dynamics I enjoyed about it aren't there, and because of that it'll feel cheap and dishonest to me if they suddenly do a u-turn back to that. I didn't care much for the little nuggets we got in 2.0 either. Yeah there was a familiar scene or two but the connective tissue is absent.
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Postby Joseki » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:51 am

View Original PostBlueBasilisk wrote:I like Asuka/Shinji in NGE buy not in the film series because all of the scenes and developing character dynamics I enjoyed about it aren't there, and because of that it'll feel cheap and dishonest to me if they suddenly do a u-turn back to that. I didn't care much for the little nuggets we got in 2.0 either. Yeah there was a familiar scene or two but the connective tissue is absent.


A lot of the Asuka/Shinji dynamics weren't in NGE either. Then Death & Rebirth happened.
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