I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final instalment made its debut in Japan on March 8, 2021.

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I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby Yomber » Sat Mar 21, 2015 5:18 pm

Ok first of all. I have a HUGE question about the "age" thing. 15 years has passed (in 3.0) but NO ONE looks like to be older. Not even the old gramps , who should be on deaths door seems to have gained a bruise.

My crazy theory is that he is under some type of "Fate"(yes the anime) dilemma. That when he truly wished for something at the end of Evangelion 2.0, he was to be tested for his verdict.

That is why I think it would finally make sense why he weren't given answer, anywhere at all in the movie, maybe I´m becoming as shinji-crazy about this but the "forbidden" zone, that he should have known, is like to me. That he was transported to an alternative dimension.

The -Angel- Kaworu. Acted like a messiah to release Shinji from his verdict.

And to my final : The reason that we aren't given any preview at all. Is because it would ruin the holy suprise of the ending.

It was weird that no one looked older, atleast for me, I think that no one would know if someone didn't tell us, that 15 years had passed.

How to explain this? That it was all batshit crazy over magical future dimension Shinji psychological outbreak of Rei's holy power?

It might as well could have been all a dream created from Shinji's own anticipation.

Remember, Evangelion has been all angels. Every episode have been about some HUGE trial. Evangelion 3.33 was different. I theorize it is because the whole instance (!) was literally an angel.

So to my final verdict: Why is the movie titled 3.0 + 1.0 ? I think it is because it refers the (+1.0) for the timeline. It might would be a huuuge stretch to say it is but remember that each film have been 1.11, 2.22 and 3.33 yet this final lays over the floor and say 3.0 and 1.0.

Which I find it weird (as in interesting). But really I don't think there is any continuation from the dystopia created in Evangelion 3.33.

I created a thread about the tape: http://forum.evageeks.org/thread/17262/The-Tape-Players-true-purpose/ And got a very well done post and analysis which I fully agree with, it couldnt have been done better.

Now to explain that part. If the tape player will have any relevance in the future, it will work as a convict to bring Shinji back to the past. because of Rei's spiritual power ! :P

Maybe the quest in 3.33, was to find Rei Ayanami once again (we saw in 2.22 Shinji literally becoming an alien)

Which is why the title is named 3.0+1.0 Because the quest of finding Rei is complete and +1.0 equals to 4. And 4 means can be interpreted as "death" Or refer to "stairs to climb" (not really sure on the latter)

But yeah. To end this: I think my theory has a 44% chance to be correct (pun intended) but according to the interviews I have read so far, Anno has said that the fourth film will shock us once again, and thus I arrived to my perhaps crazy conclusion from it.
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Re: I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby Reichu » Sat Mar 21, 2015 7:02 pm

View Original PostYomber wrote:15 years has passed (in 3.0) but NO ONE looks like to be older.

Sakura, Hyuga, and Aoba don't? Fuyutsuki doesn't (seriously)? Of course aging isn't applied as liberally as one might expect, but there are some reasons for this.

(A) Anime characters (at least drawn using Sadamoto's style) tend to lack enough facial features to make fifteen years of aging even noticeable.
(B) The staff are probably averse to making characters like Misato and Ritsuko old hags.
(C) Asuka, Mari, Rei, Kaworu, and Shinji aren't aged on purpose.
(D) Gendo is a cyborg now. Who knows what's going on there.

according to the interviews I have read so far, Anno has said that the fourth film will shock us once again, and thus I arrived to my perhaps crazy conclusion from it.

"It was all just a dream / illusion / whatever" is a possibility that audiences default to so quickly there's no way on earth it could be shocking. It's actual consequences -- irreversible consequences -- that shock people these days, not the plot equivalent of "get out of jail" cards.

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Mar 21, 2015 8:41 pm

Ritsuko in Eva Q looks just as old (if not a tad older) than Naoko did in NGE when she was called an “old hag.”

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Postby Mr. Tines » Sun Mar 22, 2015 3:16 am

Japanese women tend to age rather gracefuly, at least until the menopause. Q!Fuyutsuki should only be in his early 70s, but looks more like he's pushing 90.
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Postby Fredsq » Sun Mar 22, 2015 5:18 am

They wouldn’t build up all this expectation for Q if it weren’t real. We as audience felt lost, then angry, then sad, then hopeless, only to be rewarded at the end with some light at the end of the tunnel which will be concluded in FINAL. I refuse to believe Anno would do this to us. We’ve now studied, familiarised ourselves with the concept of how the world is like in Q, it couldn’t all be a lie.

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Re: I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby Yomber » Sun Mar 22, 2015 1:30 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Sakura, Hyuga, and Aoba don't? Fuyutsuki doesn't (seriously)? Of course aging isn't applied as liberally as one might expect, but there are some reasons for this.

(A) Anime characters (at least drawn using Sadamoto's style) tend to lack enough facial features to make fifteen years of aging even noticeable.
(B) The staff are probably averse to making characters like Misato and Ritsuko old hags.
(C) Asuka, Mari, Rei, Kaworu, and Shinji aren't aged on purpose.
(D) Gendo is a cyborg now. Who knows what's going on there.


"It was all just a dream / illusion / whatever" is a possibility that audiences default to so quickly there's no way on earth it could be shocking. It's actual consequences -- irreversible consequences -- that shock people these days, not the plot equivalent of "get out of jail" cards.


Well to me, they were used as "storyholders" to make the film make sense if few of them were older.

But I still think there are questions left to be answered:
Their base in 2.22 was in an incredible bad shape, how did they make the funds and even develop a new technology= to be able to fly in only 15 years with a huge ship?
The answer to that would be he was transferred to a different dimension, where those things were possible. But I could easily see it would be possible if America shared their technology with them and then easily fly. So I wouldn't be too caught in my mind.

Correct me please if I´m super wrong but 3.0 had a strong amount of time where Shinji spent in a self devoted prison. Meaning he should have been aware of the time in 2.0 because he decided to make a different move then what they said for once (remember in 2.22 at the end they actually encouraged him to follow his dreams but for this time he didnt listen since he saw everyone to be disappointed) and thus made his decision
.
If he was asleep for 15 years, it would be strange for him to become awake with no amnesia, but he remembered almost everything that happened in the previous films. Meaning, he probably already was an "angel-like" form. And becoming an angel means that you can transport to different places in an unnatural way but that is a topic that I have no way to disclosure since it's all in a theory.

But anyway I´m probably not wanting this conversation if dimensions exist in Evangelion (even if in some places it is strongely encouraged for a hint they do)

:
They wouldn’t build up all this expectation for Q if it weren’t real. We as audience felt lost, then angry, then sad, then hopeless, only to be rewarded at the end with some light at the end of the tunnel which will be concluded in FINAL. I refuse to believe Anno would do this to us. We’ve now studied, familiarised ourselves with the concept of how the world is like in Q, it couldn’t all be a lie.


Anno isn't afraid of destroying expectations and eating it alive. He has showed it several times. Including the newest 3.0 which only a few people perhaps thought it was a good film (= from the majority). And everyone, or should, ask, "how will be able to incercept 3.0 for what it is"? Well the obvious answer in my mind is to say by him making 3.0 becoming a better movie in our perspectives.

I´m not determined to say that "I am the correct in this one" but the discussion value should be there to prove or "may be proved" that this isn't the case or that it is the case.

And TLDR:

In a way it would be still shocking for the movie to be in a different setting again, Anno is probably not trying to mindfuck us but he tries to tell his story his way and we want to catch his thought :P
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Postby AuraTwilight » Sun Mar 22, 2015 2:06 pm

There aren't enough clues in the narrative or artistic representation of the movie for it to be a non-physical space of any kind when Evangelion has consistently done so in every single medium and continuity.

Also it's thematically inconsistent with everything Q is trying to say about the storyline and Shinji's character development, which is that he has the face the consequences of his actions for the rest of his life and there are no easy escapes or do-overs.
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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sun Mar 22, 2015 2:20 pm

Didn't read the entire post.

But seeing as how Hideaki Anno as an artist feels more present, involved & passionate in 3.0 then he was in the first 2 films I'd say any theories about the film not taking place have zero credibility.

Honestly the first two films are really just a warm up to the meat of the Rebuild tetralogy which is the last two entries.

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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Sun Mar 22, 2015 7:28 pm

Alternate idea, 1.0 and 2.0 did but didn't happen and 3.0 is real.
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Postby unitM » Wed Mar 25, 2015 11:42 am

View Original PostChaddyManPrime wrote:Alternate idea, 1.0 and 2.0 did but didn't happen and 3.0 is real.
I think there was a theory floating around somewhere on Shinji waking up in Q from a sleep in the previous NGE series.

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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Wed Mar 25, 2015 11:57 am

^
Yeah, I think the only problem I would have with that is, how would Yui, Shinji, or Leilel, know the outcome so well?
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Re: I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby Bagheera » Wed Mar 25, 2015 1:31 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:(B) The staff are probably averse to making characters like Misato and Ritsuko old hags.


44 is not quite up there enough to qualify for "old hag" status, I would think. Those two have aged well, certainly, but even so they're clearly older than they were in previous movies.
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Re: I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby The Cruel » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:09 pm

View Original PostBagheera wrote:44 is not quite up there enough to qualify for "old hag" status, I would think. Those two have aged well, certainly, but even so they're clearly older than they were in previous movies.


And behaving like some some pseudo Gendo and Fujutsuki imitations, despite being the good guys. The last thing I expect from Misato and the others is, that they 'll give zero chances for Shinji to atone his mistakes. Then it serves them right to feel guilty for what they did to him, when the last judgement starts. But let's hope for something more original in the next film, something what's very surprising and more unpredictable.
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Re: I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby Bagheera » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:16 pm

View Original PostThe Cruel wrote:And behaving like some some pseudo Gendo and Fujutsuki imitations, despite being the good guys. The last thing I expect from Misato and the others is, that they 'll give zero chances for Shinji to atone his mistakes. Then it serves them right to feel guilty for what they did to him, when the last judgement starts. But let's hope for something more original in the next film, something what's very surprising and more unpredictable.


"Zero chances," you say. But it's not like they had a choice in the matter, since ReiQ intervened before they could properly address matters. "Gendo and Fuyutsuki imitations" my ass. They were doing their best, and got screwed hard by Gendo, ReiQ, and Shinji himself. Wherever we place the blame for Q, Wille is not the proper target.
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Re: I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:21 pm

View Original PostBagheera wrote:44 is not quite up there enough to qualify for "old hag" status, I would think.

Yeah, especially since the "old hag" was an opinion an adult Gendo had had of an older woman. His idea of an old hag is probably much older than a teenager's idea of an old hag.

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Re: I think we will be mindfucked again. 3.0 didnt happen..

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Postby The Cruel » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:55 pm

View Original PostBagheera wrote:"Zero chances," you say. But it's not like they had a choice in the matter, since ReiQ intervened before they could properly address matters. "Gendo and Fuyutsuki imitations" my ass. They were doing their best, and got screwed hard by Gendo, ReiQ, and Shinji himself. Wherever we place the blame for Q, Wille is not the proper target.


If you say so then let's hope that they won't treat him in Guantanamo-Style to traumatise him more.

Cold stares and ignoring him are as possible as some potential beatings and insults from Asuka and the danger of getting crippled by her and some beatings, threats, harassments, torture and insults from WILLE-Employees, and so on and so forth.

Shinji 'll be their bitch, or what do you think?
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Postby pwhodges » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:00 pm

Well, I've written what I think already, as a fanfic.
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Postby Chuckman » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:06 pm

43 years old isn't exactly an old hag. Some women age dramatically, some don't look much different at 20 or 40.

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Postby Bagheera » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:14 pm

View Original PostChuckman wrote:43 years old isn't exactly an old hag. Some women age dramatically, some don't look much different at 20 or 40.


Or 60. Dear gods, Christie Brinkley must've made a pact with the devil. And Elle . . . holy shit, man, Elle.

View Original PostThe Cruel wrote:Shinji 'll be their bitch, or what do you think?


As to this, no, I don't think so. I think Q itself shows the lie of this, and Final will continue in the same vein.
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
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Postby AuraTwilight » Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:55 pm

If Wille intended to do anything unethical with Shinji they wouldn't of had Sakura Suzuhara, an extremely compassionate, diplomatic, and sympathetic person in the situation, be his primary overseer during his detaining.
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