Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Bagheera » Fri Jul 01, 2016 7:04 am

View Original PostRay wrote:the whitewashed Death Note movie has officially begun filming.

http://collider.com/death-note-movie-filming/


That's not whitewashing, it's localization. Most of the Japanese characters had their names changed, so there's no case of a white person playing a Japanese in the film (apart from L, I guess, but there's nothing Japanese about that name to begin with so it doesn't matter who plays him). The one Japanese name mentioned, Watari, is played by a Japanese (or an American of Japanese descent? Can't find much info on him), Paul Nakauchi.

So no, bad example for the thread. Still a shitty story not worth making into a movie (much less four movies and a Western localization), but whatever.
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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby backseatjesus » Sat Jul 02, 2016 1:36 am

L's not meant to be completely Japanese.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Reichu » Sat Jul 02, 2016 4:16 am

View Original PostBagheera wrote:Still a shitty story not worth making into a movie (much less four movies and a Western localization), but whatever.

I pretty much hated the anime and even I think this is harsh...

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Sachi » Sat Jul 02, 2016 5:13 am

I initially avoided watching Death Note because it was popular (and at that time I hated popular things for the sake of it). When I finally watched it, I expected to hate it and probably even tried to, however, I thought it was done well for what it was. The series managed to build tension and remain engaging. Up until L died, I loved how it was handled. I rewatched it maybe a year ago, and even that last arc after L's death was a bit more enjoyable. It's not among the greatest series out there, but it still stands out from the sea of other shit that gets churned out each year.

As for whitewashing: certainly the premise of Death Note is not one that is inherently Japanese. A genius narcissist finds a supernatural book that gives him that power to kill anyone he'd like; he initially uses it for justice, but eventually lets the power get to him as he embroils himself in a battle of wits against a genius detective. The Shinigamis will be the most that needs to get reworked.
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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Jul 02, 2016 6:24 am

View Original PostRay wrote:the whitewashed Death Note movie has officially begun filming.

http://collider.com/death-note-movie-filming/
[...]
Abandon all hope!

This is exactly howI feel about the Japanese-Washed Unforgiving movie.

No, wait...

View Original PostBagheera wrote:So no, bad example for the thread. Still a shitty story not worth making into a movie (much less four movies and a Western localization), but whatever.

This is about I feel about the Japanese-Washed Unforgiven.

Also, I've never seen nor cared about Death Note. But I understand the universality of its concept. European-American characters can kill people by writing names down in a weird book just as well as a Native Japanese character can.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby robersora » Sat Jul 02, 2016 6:53 am

Ls black, Watari's Japanese, the story dies not demand to be set in Japan. White-washing is something else.
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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Ray » Sat Jul 02, 2016 6:36 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote: Also, I've never seen nor cared about Death Note. But I understand the universality of its concept. European-American characters can kill people by writing names down in a weird book just as well as a Native Japanese character can.


The problem is that, this is a role where it actually makes sense to cast Asian or Asian American characters in the leads because it's a property that originated in Asia (Like Edge Of Tomorrow). But once again, the film industry and the numerous producers decide to put all the Asians in the background, and as I've stated before, when an Asian actor (Edward Zo) did go to audition for the role of Light, he was told TO HIS FACE by both his agent, and the casting director. "Sorry, we're not auditioning Asian actors for this part".

https://youtu.be/hdxz2htgPiQ?t=56

WTF?

Let me put this in perspective. AFI has a list of the top 100 Villains in Hollywood movies, and you know the truth? They're almost entirely white. With two exceptions, Denzel Washington as Detective Harris in Training Day, and James Earl Jones as the voice of Darth Vader. None of them we're Asian, or Hispanic. Death Note would have been PERFECT for bucking that trend.

This was a chance to give an Asian actor a role as a brilliant, sexy, competent, and above all else NUANCED villain, and not as a No Name Viet-Cong or North Korean soldier, or a racist Yellow Peril Caricature.

Yet once again, the people in charge of making these movies give it to a white guy. A white guy who has every opportunity to audition for another role that he more than likely would have actually gotten. While an Asian-American actor doesn't have any other lead roles to audition for and have a chance in hell of getting, unless he moves to Asia.

Despite the fact that the movie has already been dropped by the studio that optioned it (Warner Bros), is already on Netflix (home to such wonderful fare as Adam Sandler's Ridiculous 6) , features a majority No-Name, No A-list cast (Aside from Paper Towns, what has Nat Wolff starred in that's actually made money? what has Keith Stanfield done besides Straight Outta Compton?), it deals with a concept that requires little money (it takes place in the modern day) and it has next to no CGI(You could make Ryuk a guy in prosthetic makeup), and is based on a popular series of graphic novels that have an entirely Asian cast! Would it really have been that much of a risk to cast an Asian in the lead role of a character whose last name is YAGAMI in the source material?

This is exactly how feel about the Japanese-Washed Unforgiven movie.

That's a Japanese film a country that is 99% Asian. Not America, which has a much MUCH wider casting pool. Asian American actors get screwed over by the Hollywood system at every single turn, and that's something most Asian actors living in Asia and starring in ASIAN films would never understand.

L's black,

I'll readily admit I jumped the gun here. But I highly doubt Keith has the range necessary to do L justice. That's just my opinion of him as an actor.

Watari's Japanese,

and he'll no doubt be in the background. The Kano to L's Green Hornet, with no deeper nuance or character development. Just like the roles every other Asian actors in Hollywood is forced to take in order to not starve to death.

White-washing is something else.

Giving a role that was Asian in the source material to a white actor in the movie or TV adaptation IS Whitewashing. In my opinion, if a movie doesn't respect the source material enough to get the race of the characters right. Then that's a good sign the rest of the film is going to suck.
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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby movieartman » Sat Jul 02, 2016 7:31 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:This is about I feel about the Japanese-Washed Unforgiven.

How is Unforgiven a shitty story?
It's one of the most acclaimed westerns of all time!

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Jul 02, 2016 8:22 pm

View Original Postmovieartman wrote:How is Unforgiven a shitty story?
It's one of the most acclaimed westerns of all time!

Eh. Okay, Unforgiven wasn't bad, but I didn't think it was anything great either. Honestly, I just feel year 1992 was just kind of a weak year as far as Oscar nominations go.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Chuckman » Mon Jul 04, 2016 12:19 pm

View Original PostSachi wrote:I initially avoided watching Death Note because it was popular (and at that time I hated popular things for the sake of it). When I finally watched it, I expected to hate it and probably even tried to, however, I thought it was done well for what it was. The series managed to build tension and remain engaging. Up until L died, I loved how it was handled. I rewatched it maybe a year ago, and even that last arc after L's death was a bit more enjoyable. It's not among the greatest series out there, but it still stands out from the sea of other shit that gets churned out each year.

As for whitewashing: certainly the premise of Death Note is not one that is inherently Japanese. A genius narcissist finds a supernatural book that gives him that power to kill anyone he'd like; he initially uses it for justice, but eventually lets the power get to him as he embroils himself in a battle of wits against a genius detective. The Shinigamis will be the most that needs to get reworked.


Get Peter Jackson's people on it and bring back the reaper creature from The Frighteners.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Tumbling Down » Tue Jul 05, 2016 6:00 am

Everyone's sitting here complaining about the Death Note movie not being Asian enough, and I just want to complain about it not being musical enough.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby robersora » Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:55 am

View Original PostRay wrote:Giving a role that was Asian in the source material to a white actor in the movie or TV adaptation IS Whitewashing. In my opinion, if a movie doesn't respect the source material enough to get the race of the characters right. Then that's a good sign the rest of the film is going to suck.


The quality of a product and the set of social issues it might entail are two pair of shoes, though.
The story of Death Note does not demand to be set in Japan, so it's not whitewashing. Especially considering that we know of 5 cast members, two of which are non-white, making the ratio 40% to 60%, which leaves us with a more than appropriate amount of minorities if you compare it to the racial make-up of the US-populace.
We don't know, how big Watari's role is going to be, and we don't know, how well Keith Stansfield will act. Let's not jump to conclusions here.
It's the same thing as the Gits-LA-adaption. If the plot doesn't demand it to be set in Japan, and the Major is still a body switching ghost, there's no reason it should be set in Japan.
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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Chuckman » Tue Jul 05, 2016 1:36 pm

View Original PostTumbling Down wrote:Everyone's sitting here complaining about the Death Note movie not being Asian enough, and I just want to complain about it not being musical enough.


Most movies aren't musical enough.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Tumbling Down » Tue Jul 05, 2016 3:13 pm

View Original PostChuckman wrote:Most movies aren't musical enough.

Thank you!

Edit: Waaaaaaaait a minute. There's no mention of Ryuk in the casting. Are they removing the shinigami?

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Ray » Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:02 pm

This'll be my last post here for a while. . .

Asian American actress Constance Wu went on a merciless rant criticizing Matt Damon's new movie 'The Great Wall". Which is about. . .once again. A white man going to a culture that isn't his own, and becoming the greatest at that culture/savior of that culture.

http://www.vulture.com/2016/07/constanc ... acist.html



On one hand, I've made my opinion on this backwards BS, and my opinions on the Chinese Market hurting roles for Asian American actors very clear. On the other hand, I disagree with her social justice 'microagression' argument, which basically says that a white man can NEVER learn from a culture that isn't his own.

- - -

and. . . Marvel/Sony isn't just whitewashing the Ancient One.

They're also (allegedly) whitewashing Ganke Lee. Who is an Asian character, and one of Miles Morales best friends in the comic books.
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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Fri Jul 29, 2016 11:20 pm

Problem with Zhang Yimou's THE GREAT WALL is this is not a simple case of Hollywood whitewashing. The movie is primarily a Chinese film production made with Hollywood assistance & from my understanding it was the Chinese film industry who wanted a white Hollywood star for the lead role. It's kind of like a big marketing gimmick for them - we got a big Hollywood movie star to be the lead character in OUR movie - and they didn't want an Asian actor for the lead role. The American market is the also-ran for this movie. The Great Wall is getting a December 2016 release in China & will probably be pushed as their biggest movie of the year. Here in the States The Great Wall will get a release in February and may make a little bit of money but this movie was not really made with American audiences in mind. In this case the blame should be held to the Chinese investors because they WANTED a white male to play the lead role & pushed for it. Over in China only a handful of Hollywood productions make it over to their theaters - about 30 or so a year - and the majority of films playing in theaters are Chinese films starring Chinese actors (like the remake of What Women Want starring Andy Lau & Gong Li).

I'm on her side in a way. But, this is a lot more complicated than just another classic case of whitewashing. China wanted this. It's more complicated.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Reichu » Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:29 am

Kind of an aside, but I really hate the term "people of color". It sounds like someone tried to translate a translation of "colored person" back into English and did a shit job. Plus how the fuck is a fair complexioned east Asian or Indian or whatever any more "colorful" than a western European of equivalent melanin content? I also think the whole "white" grouping is one of the most artificial and absurd things there is, so I'm pretty equal opportunity here.

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby backseatjesus » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:15 pm

So Willem Dafoe was cast as Ryuk in Adam Wingard's Death Note. This is probably the best thing this movie has done so far.
http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/34015 ... shinigami/

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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Sachi » Tue Aug 02, 2016 9:23 pm

View Original Postbackseatjesus wrote:So Willem Dafoe was cast as Ryuk in Adam Wingard's Death Note. This is probably the best thing this movie has done so far.
http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/34015 ... shinigami/

^No fucking way. Now I have to go see this movie. Holy shit, is that not perfect casting or what? (and no, I don't care about whitewashing)
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Re: Whitewashing And Diversity In Hollywood?

Postby Ray » Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:43 pm

View Original PostSachi wrote:^No fucking way. Now I have to go see this movie. Holy shit, is that not perfect casting or what? (and no, I don't care about whitewashing)


I'm not all that upset over it because. You could cast ANYONE as Ryuk, because he's a Supernatural being that looks like a cross between a Dinosaur and Marylin Manson. He's not a human character, so you could use that role to cast an A-list white actor to sell the movie.

I'm just sad they couldn't cast some no-name Asian talent for L and Light.

ASIAN AMERICAN'S TALK THE GREAT WALL CONTROVERSY
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