Netflix English Dub Discussion

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Postby FelipeFritschF » Fri Jun 21, 2019 4:50 pm

That is definitely a valid translation, because the "suki" in the original text is ambiguous, but I think "like" encompasses anything from intimacy (asvKaworu has no understanding of levels of intimacy) to "like-like" to anything in between, like godly love, love for humanity etc. Weird that they went with "worthy of my grace", that suggests godly love way too much. "Sympathy" works better, though.

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Postby bobgoesw00t » Fri Jun 21, 2019 5:51 pm

I don't know if this is true for everyone or not, but for me it had the audio track set to Japanese by default which I'm thankful for. But I WAS interested in hearing the new dub when I started the first episode so I skipped the opening and I literally heard ONE line from Shinji and I went, "NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE!!!!!" The fact that she didn't even TRY to make her voice sound boyish was instant nails of a chalkboard and the delivery made me want to rip my ears off. So I've been watching it with the original audio track instead. It sucks that it feels like they didn't even try to put any effort into the new dub which is sad since some of the cast are veterans of the voice over world, like Johnny Yong Bosch and Ben Diskin and I know that they probably nailed it (I haven't even bothered with switching back to the new dub OTL). Hopefully this kind of thing won't happen again, but if it does maybe they'll include the original dub along with the new one :3
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Postby Clover » Fri Jun 21, 2019 5:55 pm

As a pleb without youknowwhat-Flix, how do they translate the first SEELE scene early on in EoE?

The ADV and later fan subs always seemed like a mistranslation that didn't get the true meaning of SEELE's words across.

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Postby Rommel » Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:45 pm

Christ, if they were going to fuck up this badly why bother with a dub at all?

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Postby Kenno! » Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:48 pm

Hello all,

Really think the dub just feels really flat and void of any strong emotional feelings compared to the original.

I could overlook some of the line changes if the voices had a bit more passion to them. Then again I have no idea where this "balls to the wall" line come from



It's such a shame.

Also yes, I have dug out an account that has not been logged into or used for over 10 years to say this.

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Postby Chuckman » Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:23 pm

Can I just say I’m glad that Asuka actually sounds like a fourteen year old now?
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Postby FelipeFritschF » Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:49 pm

I'm used to Tiffany's performance too much, but she doesn't sound bad at all. Misato is pretty good, too. Shinji is... not very good.

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Postby Guy Nacks » Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:55 pm

So, I watched Death(True)2, EOE, and a few episodes and here are my general thoughts:

I think that the casting in general is better than the old dub. The teens actually sound like teens and not late 30-something VA's pitching their voices higher to sound youthful. McKeon in particular is a marked improvement over Grant in this sense. I think the only casting choice that feels sort of out of place is Hyuga. They should have switched his VA with Kensuke's.

I think that most of the criticisms I have stem from the script being a translation that was perhaps TOO literal and lacking a sense of adaptation for the English language. For example, there were some moments where characters other than Rei would not use contractions, and that just feels unnatural for everyday speakers of English.

Also, some pronunciations felt weird:

Lance of LonGYnus
Professor Fu-yut-suki
"Nerufu" (this one kinda sounds like they were trying to pronounce it the way the Japanese cast did, instead of with the hard V)

I mean, I didn't hate the dub. But I'm not a dub person to begin with.
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Postby Chuckman » Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:59 pm

I’m watching EoE to see if they included “hit em again!”
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Postby xtr00kvltcorex » Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:02 pm

View Original PostChuckman wrote:I’m watching EoE to see if they included “hit em again!”


They actually fixed almost every mistranslation and poor audio choice in EoE, save for, y'know, the new dub.
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Postby Guy Nacks » Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:14 pm

I think they also took out both F-bombs that the original dub had. I could do without the Misato one, but taking out "I'm so fucked up" and replacing it with "I'm the lowest...of the low" takes a lot of punch out of the end of that scene. It's another instance of the disadvantages of going with a more literal translation.
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Postby Chuckman » Sat Jun 22, 2019 12:04 am

They took out my favorite part of the whole god damn movie.

The voice actors are a definite improvement though.

Asuka’s new VA killed it. She’s great.
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Postby Reichu » Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:32 am

View Original PostFelipeFritschF wrote:Weird that they went with "worthy of my grace", that suggests godly love way too much. "Sympathy" works better, though.

"Grace" is a perfectly valid translation of koui. (Scroll down to the Wordnet entries here.) Considering who and what Kaworu is, evoking God is not exactly inappropriate. :p

The uproar over suki and cries over -- lmfao -- "censorship" makes me just shake my head. You're correct that "like" perfectly captures the ambiguity of the word, but even more than that, the way Kaworu says it is somewhat indirect in the first place (in a way that does not really translate at all)! It was never meant to be some straightforward declaration of gay love or whatever.

Oh, dub? I have zero affection for the old one and am glad there's something actually completely free of the usual suspects for a change. It's not without its disappointments, but I'll gladly judge its failures in the context of it being a fresh attempt at adaptation, and not as an endless series of comparisons to a previous dub created under suboptimal conditions.

My spouse put it on so I didn't hear the first two episodes. I felt, to its credit, it didn't make me want to run away screaming until episode 21, at which point the endless barrage of bad "Seele" and "Fuyutsuki" mispronunciations tested my patience to the breaking point. That's far as we got.

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Postby ShinKikoho96 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:34 am

There seems to be a lot of, "I don't like dubs, but I'm giving my unsolicited opinion on something I dislike!" going around. If you don't like dubs in general, then you do not have the right to critique dubs in general. Now, it's one thing to oppose the 1996 English dub of Evangelion. That dub is rather outdated, wooden amongst other things. It's another to dislike the format in general, whilst at the same time whining about the format. I don't like liver. You don't see me posting on forums dedicated to liver as that is akin to trolling. If dubs as a whole are something you do not appreciate, then do NOT talk about dubs. Only dub fans have a right to critique dubs. Make sense, right?

I am a general dub fan and my critique of the 1996 dub is based on my appreciation of dubs. Because it is not a reflection of dubs in and of itself. Dubs are about as diverse as anime itself and dubs have been around as long as modern anime has been around. They don't have a set quality. It wouldn't even be right to say that Animaze dubs are "awesome". Remember their early 90s dubs? They were just as problematic as other companies. Not all Animaze dubs are on the level of Big O, Akira, Cowboy Bebop, Wolf's Rain, the SAC series and Code Geass.

I have not seen the new Evangelion dub. I am open-minded as a general dub fan. It might be good or it might not be good. But come on, be fair.

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Postby Chuckman » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:40 am

I only ever watch dubs, as I was elected to lead, not to read, but that’s kind of gatekeeping is unnecessary. Someone who hates dubs has every right to critique a dub. I may disagree with Reichu over the primacy of accuracy to the original translation, but it’s wrong to try to silence her on the grounds that she doesn’t like dubs or whatever.
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Postby kuribo-04 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:47 am

Some thoughts.
It sounds better than the old English dub. Definitely (keep in mind though I have only seen individual scenes in both cases).
EoE and some of the last episodes are too much though.
You need actors like the ones in the original cast for such complex emotions.
I don't think they are on that level.
And have yet to find someone who can reach Ogata's Shinji screams of horror. (Ogata is god tier though.)

I personally wouldn't watch the show with this dub.
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Postby BlueBasilisk » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:56 am

View Original PostGuy Nacks wrote:
Lance of LonGYnus
"Nerufu" (this one kinda sounds like they were trying to pronounce it the way the Japanese cast did, instead of with the hard V)

I think 'Longinus' might be a case of insistent terminology from khara. Kaworu pronounces it that way, or very close to it, in the final 3.33 dub.And it sounded like they were trying to pronounce 'Nerv' and 'Seele' with German accents with mixed results.

Speaking of, any native German speakers who can critique Asuka's pronunciations?
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Postby ShinKikoho96 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:59 am

Chuckman, I understand what you're trying to say, but I disagree. Do we take the opinions of anime haters who do nothing but attack anime seriously? Of course we don't! If dubs as a whole are not your thing, then why should I take the opinions of anime dub haters seriously? I'm not saying all dubs are good. They're not. However, since dubs are such a Marmite format, then only those who appreciate them can honestly critique them.

There are those who critique the 1996 Evangelion dub because they are dub fans who feel that Evangelion is not what a dub could be. I am one of those. However, there are more insidious types. There are those who attack the dub for things that it does poorly, HOWEVER, they attribute the failings of Evangelion's dubs to MOST or ALL dubs and they make dumb generalisations.

How can you fairly critique something that INHERENTLY irks you? A lot of people don't critique the Evangelion dubs because Evangelion has unfortunately not received good dubs. They attack them because THEY ARE DUBS IN AND OF THEMSELVES. This is the problem. My stance on the Evangelion dubs is the same as PenguinTruth. I am aware of Penguin. Although he is critical of the Evangelion dubs, NEVER will he say that all or most dubs are bad. He may expect a lot from dubs as a whole as do I, BUT he realises that dubs as a whole are diverse and appreciates them.

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Postby kuribo-04 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:12 am

Speaking of, any native German speakers who can critique Asuka's pronunciations?

You definitely hear (based on the bit in episode 8) that she isn't a native speaker. Some parts are a little wrong. But it's fine. She put effort in.
Doesn't bother me at all.
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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:15 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:Can I just say I’m glad that Asuka actually sounds like a fourteen year old now?


I've been only checking out certain scenes with the new dub (DC 22 for instance) but this especially makes me happy. I love that Shinji sounds like a teenager, too!
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