Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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Re: Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

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Postby Mr. Tines » Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:25 am

View Original PostPenPen4life wrote:No idea why you're bringing the prequels into this or what point you're responding to.


Yours was a needlessly combative post; please try to be rather more relaxed about things.

Also

>prequels

does make a rather large and controversial assumption.
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Re: Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:24 pm

View Original PostPenPen4life wrote:Again, every story has elements that could be paid off in later installments. Untill they are actually paid off, there's no need to assume they will be. If we aren't willing to discuss what is available, then we shouldn't discuss it at all.

I'm not stating that we should either. I'm just asking if the experience of watching the movies in their current state is satisfying without the conclusion. If Shin Eva never comes out, are these still satisfying movies to watch? (I would personally answer "yes," but that's just me. I've had great fun just watching up until Eva Q and leaving it as is. In fact, I even consider the "open ending" in Q to be rather hopeful, and if Anno decided to leave it there, I would have been happy.)

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Re: Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

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Postby PenPen4life » Thu Jan 31, 2019 11:09 pm

View Original PostMr. Tines wrote:Yours was a needlessly combative post; please try to be rather more relaxed about things.

Also

>prequels

does make a rather large and controversial assumption.

aight.

And huh? The star wars prequels being prequels is an assumption?

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:I'm not stating that we should either. I'm just asking if the experience of watching the movies in their current state is satisfying without the conclusion.


Could you clarify your position here? Your inital reply to me talked about the Matrix as an example of a film whose sets ups had yet to be paid off and now you're talking about being satifised based on what's already been produced.

Your recent posts give me the impression you think I'm judging the film based on future installments...

I never said anything against "feeling satisfied" based on what's already being published. As it is, the feelings you have about a film are entirely subjective.

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Re: Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Thu Jan 31, 2019 11:27 pm

The first Matrix was satisfying despite being incomplete. The sequels were disappointing despite being complete. All of the things that complete the narrative in the sequels were considered by audiences to be boring and tedious. As funny as it sounds, The Matrix is often considered better (or, at the very least very enjoyable) in its incomplete form. Nobody likes completeing it, and many people prefer to aschew the sequels as canon anyway, thereby willingly denying Matrix of its completion in their head canon.

Can something similar be said of Rebuild? Like The Matrix, is Rebuild satisfying to watch despite its incomplete state? As The Matrix already proved, can Rebuild also be enjoyable (perhaps even forcibly) without a complete ending?

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Re: Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

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Postby Mr. Tines » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:28 am

View Original PostPenPen4life wrote:And huh? The star wars prequels being prequels is an assumption?
I'd forgotten that this was the thread where we weren't actually talking about the Rebuilds any more.
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Re: Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

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Postby PenPen4life » Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:55 am

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:The first Matrix was satisfying despite being incomplete. The sequels were disappointing despite being complete. All of the things that complete the narrative in the sequels were considered by audiences to be boring and tedious.


Which would indicate that the payoffs were badly executed or badly written. If you consider Matrix good as a standalone, then that means that the content that was setup and paid off likely made up for the badly executed sets ups for later films.


can Rebuild also be enjoyable (perhaps even forcibly) without a complete ending?

Anything can be enjoyable...
View Original PostMr. Tines wrote:I'd forgotten that this was the thread where we weren't actually talking about the Rebuilds any more.

Joeski brought it up, asserting that the rebuilds and the prequels have the same kind of relationship to the original stories they're connected with.

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Re: Debate the quality of Rebuild here. [2]

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:34 pm

View Original PostPenPen4life wrote:Which would indicate that the payoffs were badly executed or badly written. If you consider Matrix good as a standalone, then that means that the content that was setup and paid off likely made up for the badly executed sets ups for later films.

Not necessarily. Like I said before, the first Marrix film sets up things that have no pay off in the first film, and wouldn’t be paid off until the sequels. (Stuff like if Neo would have broken the vase of the Oracle hadn’t said anything. The whole sequels seem to made just to pay off that one set up in the first film.) Whole set up and pay off is important, the Wachowskis found that not everything needs to be paid off in order for a film to be enjoyable; only certain things need to be paid off.

The same thing could be said of the “Rebuilds.” Not everything needs to be paid off in some form of a conclusion in order to be enjoyable. And certain open endings (such as the ones in the first Matrix film or the one in Eva Q) can be particularly fun or interesting for the viewer.


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