Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby Cae Lumis » Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:58 am

I... tried... mounting the Entry Plug on an angle. However, interesting things happened as a result:

Image

As you can see, even using Rebuild's 80m Unit-01, both the 12m and 20m Entry Plugs don't just go *over* the location of the Core, they burst straight out of the Evangelion itself... which has some really fun implications for the TV Version's 40m version of an Evangelion come to think of it...

Is there any way the issue of where exactly the Entry Plug occupies the interior of an Evangelion be reconciled with the dimensions of it?

Update: Whoops, forgot to actually display the 10m Entry Plug in that diagram, instead only showing the 12m Plug I was toying with. I have since updated the image to include the 10m Plug and modified the above text to reflect what the image originally showed, and... it just *barely* fits at a 35-degree angle.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Sun Oct 21, 2018 12:06 pm

After looking at some screencaps, have you tried a 20°-30° angle for the insertion? 35°-45° seems too steep for sure, and the angle could be as shallow as 15° - it's very tough to tell the precise angle from the angles we see of the Entry Plug being inserted.
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby StrokeMeGoat » Sun Nov 18, 2018 6:32 am

I think your placement of the entry plug is a bit off. You can see in the gif below that the spinal armor/plug-hole and containment apparatus actually both raises AND rotates just prior to insertion, making the exact placement and angle of the entry plug rather tricky.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby pwhodges » Sun Nov 18, 2018 6:49 am

Looking frame by frame, and following marks or features on each piece, I see no rotation. There is a sideways shadow movement that might fool you.
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:59 pm

View Original PostStrokeMeGoat wrote:I think your placement of the entry plug is a bit off. You can see in the gif below that the spinal armor/plug-hole and containment apparatus actually both raises AND rotates just prior to insertion, making the exact placement and angle of the entry plug rather tricky.

Image

Yeah, the plug slot is moving straight up from its locked position, there is no change in angle whatsoever.
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby StrokeMeGoat » Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:04 am

Regardless, I feel the placement is a bit off. When I've got a bit more time I'll have a go at my own placement. It is nit picky, but we're discussing the placement and its relation to the core here, nit picking is kind of the name of the game. Keep in mind I'm not trying to criticize CL's job here, I'm trying to get the most accurate result.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:01 pm

^ No, I understand, with the constant size inconsistency, it's difficult to understand how the damn Entry Plug fits in the hole.
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby StrokeMeGoat » Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:48 pm

I know this is rebuild and not original EoTV, but since we're discussing rebuild sizes too, after a recent rewatch of 3.33, I think the entry plugs are actually the 20m size... at least going off of the Unit-13 insertion sequence. The entry plugs were clearly impossibly large just watching them Here's a not very good picture with part of the plugs cut off from view that shows us how large they are:

Image

So at least when it comes to rebuild, the entry plugs are indeed so large that they could never fit without being converted to LCL or something.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby ShonHam » Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:43 am

I think it started off mainly as poor implementation of the Unit's design, but it's still an interesting idea to ponder that it'd physically alter Unit 01's appearance.
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby Reichu » Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:53 pm

View Original PostStrokeMeGoat wrote:So at least when it comes to rebuild, the entry plugs are indeed so large that they could never fit without being converted to LCL or something.

And those aren't even the only things Eva-13 can fit in there. Insert quadruple penetration joke here.

I doubt we're meant to think the plugs convert into another material. In NGE, there are weird intimations that cores link to the Sea of LCL, which is another universe or another dimension of space or something. Entry plugs are inserted into cores. You can see where this is going. They don't have to fit because their mass and volume is accommodated by incomprehensible physics.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby ACGT-Samael » Fri Jan 25, 2019 1:09 pm

So I feel super duper dumb for not noticing sooner, but the Evas in the Graveyard clearly have artificial spinal columns, made of the same wires that form the arms. This would kind of suggest their entire central nervous system has been gutted out for the cybernetics needed to make Synchronisation work. Except the Evas have organic brains. That's even more horrifying.

It also explains why the Evas seem to be grown in pieces and then assembled: it's more work to scoop the nervous system (and possibly part of the skeleton) out of an entire being than to do so with individual sections before assembly.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby VUX » Sun Feb 24, 2019 10:55 am

Is there any particular reason why some Evangelions have more than a single pair of eyes?
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Sun Feb 24, 2019 12:08 pm

Well as far as we're aware, Evangelions are grown from an unknown sample, but perhaps there's a bit of genetic diversity in the material they're using that results in the differences in appearance between EVAs.
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby Reichu » Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:50 pm

View Original PostVUX#885520 wrote:Is there any particular reason why some Evangelions have more than a single pair of eyes?

Eva-02 is the only one that clearly has more than two biological eyes. And the original Eva-02, anyway, is... weird. She's the only Eva with indigo-colored blood and grayish-blue skin. The two production models after her went straight back to something more traditional (two eyes, red blood, etc.). Reading between the lines here, perhaps Eva-02 was an experiment in tinkering with the Eva genome that wasn't considered entirely successful, or whatever success there was wasn't worth the expenditure to get there.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby pwhodges » Mon Feb 25, 2019 1:39 pm

Experiment? Don't tell Asuka, she's so proud that her unit is the production type!
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:43 pm

^ Perhaps Kyoko did some modifications herself to the genome to improve the Evangelion in some way and they were deemed unnecessary for future units.

There's also the fact that while Unit-03 and Unit-04 were both constructed in the US, and with Unit-02 being constructed (or grown) in Germany they had different base samples to begin with.
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby Reichu » Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:01 pm

What very little that's said about Kyoko implies she's a bit of a zealot, so I made that connection myself long ago. A fitting end to be (partly) devoured by a monster of your own making. :wink: I included a tease about Kyoko's future work in the first chapter of Crying Man. It's cute, so why not...

SPOILER: Show
Kyoko, having been effectively activated, continues on her spiel. “I'm not actually interested in eugenics or anything like that. Giving your kid the 'perfect' genes? There's no such thing, so why bother? And even if it were, it's boring. Old hat.” She takes a nice, long drink. “I don't just want to shuffle around what's already there. I want to make new things. So, to that end… ” Another drink. “…I've been custom-designing new and better proteins. From there, it's a simple matter of reverse-engineering the CDS and inserting it into a genome.”

Akira, both impressed and perplexed, raises an eyebrow. “Have you… been having much success?”

Langley clicks his tongue. “It has a tendency to weird people out. Kyoko's first 'success' is something that's carried in the blood and makes it look dark purple or indigo when it's fully oxygenated.”

“Ssshh, Adrian! It hasn't been published yet!” Her tone shifts from admonishing to mischievous. “You must admit, though. The rats are rather impressive.”

“Well, yes. I'm sure any one of them could kill a small dog,” Langley quips dryly. “Truly the stuff of B movie horror. Dr. Zeppelin & the Blue-blooded Rats of Terror.”

“I would pay good money to see that,” Kyoko counters.

Akira wonders if talking to these people was a good idea after all.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:38 pm

^ I came to a similar conclusion in my own fic that different DNA was used to create the Evangelions. Kyoko created the Adam Type A sample, while the American team created the Type B sample.
    Unit-00 - Base Sample Adam (100% Adam)
    Unit-01 - Base Sample Lilith (100% Lilith)
    Unit-02/Unit-05/Unit-07 - Base Sample Adam Type A (95% Adam/5% Lilith)
    Unit-03/Unit-04/Unit-06 - Base Sample Adam Type B (95% Adam/5% Human)
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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby Reichu » Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:54 am

I'm not sure how adding some Lilith to the mix would result in Eva-02's weirdness. If you're able to mix the DNA of something like Adam with something like us, then presumably similar principles are at work, so I will proceed thusly. Lilith at face value has pure white flesh and uses LCL for blood. Eva-02 has something in the blood that gives it a DARK PURPLE color. Red+blue=purple, so there's a blue blood additive. How would "Lilith DNA" make a blue blood additive just appear out of nowhere? And it gets worse, since cloning Lilith resulted in something that looks like a dead ringer for Adam, with the exception of pigment abnormalities (which could be explained via epigenetics if you wanted to), with all the expected physical properties, like red blood. Meaning, Lilith's true form is probably something physically indistinguishable from Adam, and splicing their DNA together would basically be the same as splicing DNA from one twin into another twin. You could add redundancies to the information, at best. Normally, this would boost the chances of Very Bad things like genetic disease. The Seeds are genetically engineered, so their genome is probably much hardier, but that makes the decision to tinker with it at all even more perplexing. You're messing with the deliberate sequencing done by people FAR (pun... not intended, but fine I'll take it) more technologically advanced than we are. Tinker with what is, by our reckoning, perfection, and feel very lucky if you get results that grow from the embryonic tissue phase at all.

I don't think the deliberate contamination of the Seed genome, as accepted and repeated practice, is really the best approach to take. But, then, the mass production Evas are somehow a thing that exists, so what do I know... :tongue: If I have any point at all, it's that you should be very wary of the "Lego genetics" meme. Jurassic Park isn't a useful comparison here since Gehirn/Nerv have living tissue samples right at their fingertips; nothing needs to be reconstructed.

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Re: Eva Anatomy & Physiology: 2018 Edition

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Tue Feb 26, 2019 8:44 pm

^ Not reconstructed no, but modified. The people who built the Evangelions all were playing god, so perhaps they believed they could improve upon what they had already studies and improve it in someway to meet their own ends. I mean, they thought they could control them with technology, and looked how that turned out...

And yes, I may have gotten the idea from Jurassic Park, but splicing genes together to modify something to make it better (a la Khan Noonien Singh) is a wonderful sci-fi-esque trope that I enjoy.
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"That which does not kill us makes us stronger." Words of Wisdom from German Philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche.


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