Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby MrUnimport » Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:20 pm

Would it destroy the integrity of the project for there to be a set of subtitles for use with the Director's Cut? I understand this is a controversial issue here, but seeing as I still have some friends who haven't seen the show, I'd like them to see the Director's Cut episodes as well as what seems to be the superior set of subs.

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby Mjolnir Mark IV » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:04 am

HARVEST wrote:How about VOBSUB subtitles for the already-processed AVI files?
I did encounter some DVDs with fade-in/out in the subtitles.

This contradicts what I know about SUP files. But if you can find a way to prove you're right, I would be extremely interested.

HARVEST wrote:However, I think you should add in options for low-quality DVD-5, high-quality DVD-5 and high-quality DVD-9, since not all people can burn dual layer discs.

Good point. I'll try to remember to keep this in mind if I ever make discs an option for this project.

HARVEST wrote:Also, AFAIK, the field blending isn't ADV's fault, since the Archives DVDs are the same thing, judging from the DVD rips I got.

That would surprise me because they typically don't screw that kind of thing up in Japan with Evangelion. Hopefully it's just a botched rip you're looking at. There's no telling with bootlegs, especially NTSC sources ripped in PAL regions.

HARVEST wrote:my uncles got delayed by about a week, so it's going to take me longer to rip their DTS bootleg Perfect Collection DVDs, which I presume is identical to the official DVDs quality-wise

Based on your screenshot, I can confirm that the quality is not identical. It's immediately noticeable to me that your bootleg looks worse, even before comparing them side by side.

HARVEST wrote:I don't know if they have the Director's Cuts or the Feature Film, though, but I think they most likely don't have them.
Which means I might have to hunt for those DVDs myself through other means like eBay or Amazon, though I have limited funds so I probably can't buy stuff like that.

Try your local library. I'm always surprised by what I'm able to find at mine.

HARVEST wrote:I know that The Feature Film is still on-print but it's still too damn expensive.

Doing a cursory search, I see one going for $26.19. While that's high for a used DVD, I think it's worth it if you can afford it, because the alternative Manga DVD isn't nearly as good. And the DTS release is $14.10, although I haven't yet confirmed if the video for the DTS release is identical to the Dolby Digital release (and thus whether or not it's compatible with the EoE subtitles I did).

But didn't you say the Blu-ray release of the movie is good? You know how to use Aegisub, so adjusting my subtitles for it should be a simple task for you. If not, hit me up.

HARVEST wrote:Can you give us a timeframe on when the update of the subtitles will come out?

I've got a lot on my plate at the moment so that's difficult to do. But I would be surprised (and disappointed) if it didn't happen before 2018 is over.

HARVEST wrote:Also, you said in a previous post with Sephirotic that you will update some of those shot restorations, particularly, you will fix a glitch with the sunrise in Episode 4.

The sunrise shot in episode 4 is fixed! (As you will see in the next release.) Same for the episode 4 preview at the end of episode 3.

HARVEST wrote:This is my first time watching the Perfect Collection, and I find that it has Yebisu in some scenes, indicating that it's the home video version, except for the last six episodes, which are the TV broadcast versions.
So, I guess the Second Impact Box is still a valid unaltered version even if it's slightly different.
The AoE box is the only 100% true to the TV broadcast version

Good to know!

HARVEST wrote:But still, this slightly crappy bootleg will do until I raise enough money to buy an actual Perfect Collection box, plus the Director's Cut DVDs and the Renewal Feature Film.

You know, I haven't actually seen the Archives Box DVDs, but if I were you, I would save up for that instead of the Perfect Collection—if you can. The two sets are closer in price now than they were a few years ago. I realize my project doesn't officially support the Archives Box, but it seems like the better investment, if you can get your hands on the official release (the Second Impact Box was outrageously expensive last time I saw it for sale—but now I can't even find it). Although it sounds like you're also interested in the English audio, so if that's the case, the Perfect Collection is the best choice for the original version of the series.

HARVEST wrote:The real bad news comes from the fact that I can't use your subs with this bootleg

Too bad, but the good news is that I think you'll notice a nice difference by upgrading to an official release, if you can afford it. The bootleg release you have looks pretty low quality. Check with your local library. The Perfect Collection is all over the ones near me.

HARVEST wrote:And if I study video editing and get the clean OP from the Platinum Edition (color-corrected to match the Perfect Collection) and add in new English credits more closely accurate to the Japanese placement, since I find the English credits placement weird, especially Director: Hideaki Anno appearing after the black screen fading into Eva Unit 01.

You're going to get much better results by using the clean opening from the special features of the DC DVDs, NGE: Resurrection and NGE: Reborn, which came out before the Platinum Edition. That way you won't have to do any color correcting, which I can almost guarantee is going to be impossible to get right with the Platinum Edition. The clean opening and closing are included in both of those older DC DVDs as extras, but I forget if it's the same on both discs.

HARVEST wrote:Also, there's some untranslated text in the Perfect Collection which are subbed in the Platinum Edition.
I would really love it if you put in some of the Platinum Edition text subtitles.

I'm really glad you mentioned this. I've actually already added a few to episode 12 that you will see in the next release. However, I only added ones I happened to notice when comparing specific subtitles. I haven't gone through the entire series looking for these, so if there's any you can think of off the top of your head, let me know.

HARVEST wrote:There are also some overlays which need to be restored in Episodes 05 and 06.

Which ones? There are some minor corrections that are impractical to make to subtitles embedded into the video, and other than that, I've already restored the title screens, so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

HARVEST wrote:P.S: I think the episode numbers should be in word form to replicate the Japanese titles which are in old Kanji (I think).
The Platinum Edition uses word form numbers for the numbers.

Thank you, you bring up an excellent point here, but I think an equally important question is:
How common is it in anime for an episode number to be written in old kanji?

In other words, adapting the effect the numbers in the titles have on the viewer is just as important as considering a literal counterpart to how the numbers are written. I can't consider changing it until someone is positive (or very nearly certain) of the following:
  1. Are the numbers in the TV episode titles of Neon Genesis Evangelion (1995–1996) written in old kanji?
  2. Is such a way of numbering Japanese TV episodes in general common or uncommon? What about anime episodes specifically?
  3. Is spelling the numbers out rather than using Arabic numerals an appropriate English equation to Japanese numbers written in old kanji?

HARVEST wrote:While the Director's Cut and EoE should be in Arabic numbers.
I know that the Director's Cut episode numbers are still in old Kanji but this is to connect the Director's Cut episodes better to EoE.
For example: Air should be Episode 25, and the Director's Cut of At Least, Be Humane should be Episode 22, while the Original Airing version if it will be Episode Twenty Two.

I'm starting to get confused, so let's start with the way things are before getting into how they should be:
Which episode titles use old kanji?
Which ones use Arabic numerals?
And are there any that use...I dunno, something else?

HARVEST wrote:Unaltered (Perfect Collection):

Correction: Perfect Collection BOOTLEG.
I can tell right away it looks worse than it should.

And I'm not any happier about the changes made to the original version than you are, but it should be noted that ditching the widescreen is a change present in all releases of the edited version of the series (so that means Renewal, Platinum Edition, and Blu-ray all ditch the widescreen).

MrUnimport wrote:Would it destroy the integrity of the project for there to be a set of subtitles for use with the Director's Cut? I understand this is a controversial issue here, but seeing as I still have some friends who haven't seen the show, I'd like them to see the Director's Cut episodes as well as what seems to be the superior set of subs.

Thanks! And good question. Would it bother you if I released the DC subtitles as a separate project? It would be a companion project, so the format and look of the subtitles would be identical.

To answer your question directly, it probably wouldn't destroy the integrity of this project as long as I package it as a bonus and make it clear that the DC episodes never made it to the west on VHS. But I feel compelled to release it as a separate-but-connected project simply to prevent people from mistakenly believing that the DC episodes were officially released on VHS with English subtitles.

Bear in mind this is all hypothetical. Working on the DCs is lower priority because until I wrap up the pending corrections with the original episodes, starting work on the DCs could potentially mean doubling the workload for any corrections I make to episodes 21–24. But you're doing the right thing by expressing interest in the DC episodes. That encourages me to do them—although as I mentioned before, I also have something else up my sleeve for those...
Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles
The End of Evangelion: Fansub Amalgamation
Evangelion fan since 1996. Former Eva Mailing List member (late '90s).

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby ShonHam » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:34 am

This is really good stuff man!
I do love me some Rei guns.

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby HARVEST » Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:56 am

Thanks for the updates, I have been waiting for a long time.
My bootlegs don't have DTS but at least the audio is apparently bit-perfect with the official DVDs (I compared the audio bitrates with the official bitrates in Svenge's Compendium, and it has a Dolby Surround flag).

I wish I can sync the Perfect Collection dubs with the Archives DVDs if I get my hands on them.

I think I saw some papers in episode 05 which were photoshopped to English, not sure about episode 06, however.
Just a hunch because they were packaged together in the VHS.

As for episode 03, the emergency broadcast interruption is still photoshopped in English, and if you go frame-by-frame, you can spot a glimpse of the un-photoshopped Japanese image.
This also happens at one point in episode 14, but I think you fixed it in your subtitles anyway.

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