Internet toxicity (Social media, fandom shipping, etc)

Yeah. You read right. This is for everything that doesn't have anything to do with Eva.

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Internet toxicity (Social media, fandom shipping, etc)

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:48 pm

This is general venting instead of anything truly egregious, but I figured a quick 'n dirty rant would do some good. Not a knock on anything in particular, just purely observational and head-scratching.

Whether it's fandom culture or social media, I just don't find the...appeal of either like I used to. It feels as if there's nothing but 1) fandom bitching or entitlement (Random example: I've seen the pure hell that is shipping in those Steven Universe or 'new' Voltron fandoms, and it's very unsettling what crazy limits people are taking to kid's shows by implying things like one pairing is racist and another is 'pure'? WTF? It's a cartoon, FFS.) on one side, or 2) social media simply not feeling very 'social' on another side. As if everyone just keeps to themselves instead of (politely) engaging one another as it used to seem.

Generally I just chat with my friends (since I'm too RL busy to be active in much of anything, these days), but has anyone else noticed this?

Perhaps it's a sign of 'getting older' that I don't understand this newfound Tumblr generation, or maybe it's not even the young(?) Tumblry crowd in particular. From what I can tell, this shift seemed to begin in 2012-2013 or so. But, it certainly makes things fatiguing to witness when I like to use my time online as a means to just chill out and relax.

(Either way, I certainly make a point to limit my social media time for this reason....I have plenty of things to actually keep me busy!)
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Re: Internet toxicity (Social media, fandom shipping, etc)

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Postby Gob Hobblin » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:26 am

SSD: I have a very hard time going on Facebook these days, because it seems to have become the 'unfiltered, everyone gets to know what I think' place. Which is weird, because that's no pseudonyms (unless you're a bot). Everyone sees pictures, and names, and...there's no hiding that a person said what they said. It's up there, for everyone to see. So, I have to filter and kick away a lot of my co-workers and friends, who would NEVER talk to me like that in real life, but now feel they can get away with it online. It's like, "Ah...so that's what you really think of me. Cheers, buddy."

Social media has become too much of a minefield to deal with, frankly. I keep regretting getting an FB page because of it, but I'm too linked in to people now to delete it.

I find Tumblr easier to deal with, though, because I can at least sift that: the only things on my Tumblr feeds are artists I like and Spec Op feeds (apparently, that's a thing on Tumblr!). Of course, I'm usually just there for art, and not posts. That makes it a lot more bearable.

MuscleRobo: Once you've established that your identity was stolen, the bank should replace the funds that were used. They are generally insured against that, so go through the motions, fill out the paperwork, and you'll feel a lot better about that in a few days. I am sorry about your job, though: that always stings to get a release like that.
Though, Gob still might look good in a cocktail dress.
-Sorrow

Rei wanted to know what waffles tasted like.
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Come read EVA Sessions! This place has it, too! There'll be pizza! Not really! There are other things, too! Not EVA Sessions! Did I mention the pizza!?

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Postby jcmoorehead » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:45 am

SSD: I know what you mean, fandom culture now is incredibly toxic and really off putting. For me being a part of a fandom used to be having friends who liked that thing too, it meant talking about ships or sharing fanart/fic or light debate about aspects of the show. Now it's... a lot different, I don't know if those elements have always been there but they're certainly more noticeable than they used to be. It seems to be more focusing on anything but the show and berating people who don't agree or even the show/writers because it doesn't fit what they wanted it to be.

As far as the sociable side goes, I've noticed that too. I did try to use Tumblr but I just never felt like I was welcome in the Eva fandom there. Although I do feel that might be more down to what I ship, Tumblr is very KawoShin heavy and there tends to be a lot of people who severely dislike AsusShin. Me shipping AsuShin and writing that might have contributed :P

I dunno though, fandom now seems to focus mostly on negative aspects than just... enjoying the damn thing and it is exhausting.

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Postby Cybermat47 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:56 am

View Original Postjcmoorehead wrote:As far as the sociable side goes, I've noticed that too. I did try to use Tumblr but I just never felt like I was welcome in the Eva fandom there. Although I do feel that might be more down to what I ship, Tumblr is very KawoShin heavy and there tends to be a lot of people who severely dislike AsusShin. Me shipping AsuShin and writing that might have contributed :P


Tumblr is kind of like an echo chamber where any dissenting opinion is squashed immediately. :rolleyes:

I’m glad I left it.
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Postby silvermoonlight » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:02 am

SSD : I agree and this was one of the reasons I threw in the towel on tumblr some years ago because of the toxic nature of the place like I just hate how they ruin fandom over there and I heard about the Steven Universe thing which was terrible. I think though that social media itself has become very toxic in places over all and I think this attitude has bled in to fandoms causing problems. Granted before social media you still had fandom fights but I think the difference now is the vindictive attitudes are so full on and the shipping wars are even worse because of it. In truth this is proberbly why I prefer Evageeks forum because its quite compared to the other fandoms websites I've been on.
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My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3

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Postby Gob Hobblin » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:33 am

Is it just the Eva fandom on Tumblr that does this? Everybody keeps talking about the toxic Tumblr atmosphere, and people on Tumblr talk about it, but I have never encountered it.

Are there certain fandoms that do this? I'm not asking sarcastic questions, I am genuinely confused by this.
Though, Gob still might look good in a cocktail dress.
-Sorrow

Rei wanted to know what waffles tasted like.
-Literary Eagle

We have to remember what's important in life: friends, waffles, and work. Or waffles, friends, and work. But work has to come in third.
-Leslie Knope

Come read EVA Sessions! This place has it, too! There'll be pizza! Not really! There are other things, too! Not EVA Sessions! Did I mention the pizza!?

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Postby jcmoorehead » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:43 am

View Original PostGob Hobblin wrote:Is it just the Eva fandom on Tumblr that does this? Everybody keeps talking about the toxic Tumblr atmosphere, and people on Tumblr talk about it, but I have never encountered it.

Are there certain fandoms that do this? I'm not asking sarcastic questions, I am genuinely confused by this.


Eva fandom can be quite sedate but I think it depends on when/where you enter it too. When I first joined Tumblr it was to look up fanart for Eva, especially in relation to the pairing I liked. Unfortunately when looking at the AsuShin tags I saw a lot of negativity about it and the people who shipped it. There was also an unfortunate incident short after I posted one of my more...explicit fics i guess you could say where a few people reacted negatively towards me.

It wasn't awful, it wasn't like a big fuss that made waves but it was enough to kinda make me wary.

Eva however is certainly not as bad as other fandoms and those elements can be ignored, those people I added to my block list and I never had to deal with anything too bad.

Some fandoms do however have issues with things like people being sent death threats/being called out for liking particular ships or acting in a certain way that doesn't fit that mentality. The worst two I know of are Steven Universe and Voltron. I think as with anything though it's a very loud group of people who are ruining it for others, I imagine most people in those fandoms are fairly chill.

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Postby silvermoonlight » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:58 am

View Original PostGob Hobblin wrote:Is it just the Eva fandom on Tumblr that does this? Everybody keeps talking about the toxic Tumblr atmosphere, and people on Tumblr talk about it, but I have never encountered it.

Are there certain fandoms that do this? I'm not asking sarcastic questions, I am genuinely confused by this.


I tried to get in to the Eva fandom on tumblr as this is a few months before I packed it in and I got totality cold shouldered and I wasn't welcome because I multi ship due to my idea of the multi verses which means I think any pairing is possible. It really got to me at the time because I was returning to the fandom as I'd been a fan back in the early 2000's but this was my first taste of the online side. Plus if you want to ask other fanfiction writers advice regarding a certain pairing on there forget it as unless your not part of some club you are not welcome and the door is shut to you permanently.

I've seen the same nasty behaviour both close up and online in Star Trek, Star Wars, XWP, AVP. The worst ones I've heard about though was never part of was Attack On Titan, Death Note, Steven Universe, Yuri On Ice and the resent Voltron. Please note not all these fandoms I've mentioned are bad but some have become more toxic over time and unpleasant as they've aged.
Last edited by silvermoonlight on Sun Feb 25, 2018 6:44 am, edited 7 times in total.
Anywhere can be paradise as long as you have the will to live. After all, you are alive, so you will always have the chance to be happy.

My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3

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Postby Gob Hobblin » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:05 am

That must be it: I see Voltron and Stephen Universe fan-art, but it's usually not the focus of the artist's work (like, they're a member of the fandom, and they post their own fan-work, but they're primarily doing art somewhere else, so I'm only on the edge of all of it).

I guess I just never got deep enough into the weeds to see it.

Then again, a lot of the fandom I deal with (mostly because they have the artists I like the most) are from RWBY, and that's a community that is perfectly happy to ship anyone and everyone with gleeful abandon. You don't see the same kinds of fights between shippers there, but I also feel like Rooster Teeth is heavily involved in that fandom (and was able to kind of...not engineer, but aim and direct the better angels in the fandom over the negative qualities). I have a hunch that RWBY Chibi might have also helped with that, but I digress.

This kind of entrenchment and fighting over shipping is a strange concept to me: I have my preferred ships, but...I mean, come on: they're fictional characters. Where's the harm in one ship versus another? Like, if someone does a nice little story, or draws a cute or funny little picture, and it happens to contain a ship I don't support?

Hey, that's cute little crackship art. Not my thing, but I can appreciate it and enjoy it. Because it's FICTION.

People are weird.
Though, Gob still might look good in a cocktail dress.
-Sorrow

Rei wanted to know what waffles tasted like.
-Literary Eagle

We have to remember what's important in life: friends, waffles, and work. Or waffles, friends, and work. But work has to come in third.
-Leslie Knope

Come read EVA Sessions! This place has it, too! There'll be pizza! Not really! There are other things, too! Not EVA Sessions! Did I mention the pizza!?

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Postby Cybermat47 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:11 am

View Original Postsilvermoonlight wrote:I tried to get in to the Eva fandom on tumblr as this is a few months before I packed it in and I got totality cold shouldered and I wasn't welcome because I multi ship due to my idea of the multi verses which means I think any pairing is possible.


I see no problem with multishipping, and I don’t see how anyone could. I mean... they’re fictional characters, who cares what ships or how many ships a person has?
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Postby silvermoonlight » Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:31 am

View Original PostCybermat47 wrote:I see no problem with multishipping, and I don’t see how anyone could. I mean... they’re fictional characters, who cares what ships or how many ships a person has?


Yeah that's why it was such a shock for me because as much as I love the Eva characters I know there not real and I see them as works of fiction and in the same vein as novel characters in books as there well written and thought out. So it made me wonder if to these kinds of people the characters are really real in there minds and they think they have to protect them (And there suited pairings) at all costs hence any one who breaks the status quo in any way by being different or having different ideas is instantly crushed under foot and treated like a online cockroach that needs to be wiped out. :irked:

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Last edited by silvermoonlight on Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:13 am, edited 2 times in total.
Anywhere can be paradise as long as you have the will to live. After all, you are alive, so you will always have the chance to be happy.

My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3

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Postby Gob Hobblin » Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:11 am

People take a weird...possessiveness of these characters, and any deviation from that possession is threatening. It's almost like they treat the characters as extensions of themselves, and any attack on that idealized concept of the character becomes a personal attack.

The best example of that I can see is in the Bittersweet Candybowl fandom. Like, those kids (the characters) demolish each other. Their relationships are toxic, destructive, and painful to watch, and everybody in the fan section immediately starts jumping onto who was 'right' or 'wrong' in their behavior, taking glee in some characters being harmed, or trying to justify other characters actions. And it's, like: shit, they're ALL horrible people, but that's because they're all teenage characters dealing with things WAY outside of their scope of understanding. Of course they're going to be horrible: they're trying their best, making mistakes, and not able to figure out those mistakes. There's no good or bad guys in the whole situation, just people hurting people without trying to.
Though, Gob still might look good in a cocktail dress.
-Sorrow

Rei wanted to know what waffles tasted like.
-Literary Eagle

We have to remember what's important in life: friends, waffles, and work. Or waffles, friends, and work. But work has to come in third.
-Leslie Knope

Come read EVA Sessions! This place has it, too! There'll be pizza! Not really! There are other things, too! Not EVA Sessions! Did I mention the pizza!?

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Postby silvermoonlight » Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:38 am

View Original PostGob Hobblin wrote:People take a weird...possessiveness of these characters, and any deviation from that possession is threatening. It's almost like they treat the characters as extensions of themselves, and any attack on that idealized concept of the character becomes a personal attack.

The best example of that I can see is in the Bittersweet Candybowl fandom. Like, those kids (the characters) demolish each other. Their relationships are toxic, destructive, and painful to watch, and everybody in the fan section immediately starts jumping onto who was 'right' or 'wrong' in their behavior, taking glee in some characters being harmed, or trying to justify other characters actions. And it's, like: shit, they're ALL horrible people, but that's because they're all teenage characters dealing with things WAY outside of their scope of understanding. Of course they're going to be horrible: they're trying their best, making mistakes, and not able to figure out those mistakes. There's no good or bad guys in the whole situation, just people hurting people without trying to.


I agree Gob and this is so on point as I've seen people say they want Asuka dead and that she got what she deserved in the series because she's a bitch so that's there justification for why she deserves to be thrown under a bus in some fanfiction and fanart. Then this extends even more in to the ideal of shipping for example you'll get people who go you can not ship Shinji/Asuka because its to toxic or abusive and others that go your not allowed to ship Asuka/Rei because Asuka hates Rei.

Then you get the other side of this which is Kaworu/Shinji is the one true pairing and all heterosexual pairing are shit and should be wiped out followed by the flip side of this coin that Shinji is not gay or bisexual so stop tainting the water. Like I saw all of this in the tumblr when I was there and it was nuts and I was just going what the fuck? Reading some of the comments because when you break it down its so utterly stupid and tiresome. :facepalm:

Add to this some of these people spend so much time hating on characters and pairings instead of really enjoying the fandom and embracing its nicer stuff.
Anywhere can be paradise as long as you have the will to live. After all, you are alive, so you will always have the chance to be happy.

My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3

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Postby Gob Hobblin » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:15 am

Life's too short for that. Why would anyone want to waste time on such frustrations?

I can't remember who it was, but someone threw some Asuka/Rei stories my way: I don't ship the two of them, but the stories were cute, and funny. I can appreciate that! Or, you know...say a ship I prefer doesn't pan out in canon. The art from before isn't gone! It's still there, and still just enjoyable!
Though, Gob still might look good in a cocktail dress.
-Sorrow

Rei wanted to know what waffles tasted like.
-Literary Eagle

We have to remember what's important in life: friends, waffles, and work. Or waffles, friends, and work. But work has to come in third.
-Leslie Knope

Come read EVA Sessions! This place has it, too! There'll be pizza! Not really! There are other things, too! Not EVA Sessions! Did I mention the pizza!?

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Postby silvermoonlight » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:21 am

View Original PostGob Hobblin wrote:Life's too short for that. Why would anyone want to waste time on such frustrations?

I can't remember who it was, but someone threw some Asuka/Rei stories my way: I don't ship the two of them, but the stories were cute, and funny. I can appreciate that! Or, you know...say a ship I prefer doesn't pan out in canon. The art from before isn't gone! It's still there, and still just enjoyable!


Yeah that's thing you can still enjoy a pairing even if its not canon, you can still create fan art and fanfiction on it, it shouldn't be against the rules. There is no stone commandments saying you can't so these people are wasting so much time and effort over nothing and trying to make out there kings/queens of some castle which in reality does not exist as human taste is so subjective and everyone likes different things for different reasons and your entitled to like any pairing or pairings you wish in a fandom and no one should be telling you different.
Anywhere can be paradise as long as you have the will to live. After all, you are alive, so you will always have the chance to be happy.

My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:37 am

silvermoonlight: Mh, EGF is such a blessing compared to those other sites, huh?

About shipping overall, maybe it is just an age thing? When I was younger I was a lot more...hardcore in my viewpoint (Heck if I know why. General fandom defensiveness about MAH FAVORITES!11!, maybe??), but these days I can easily read fic/look at fanart of different pairings and appreciate the cuteness, even if they're not my favorite 'ships, you know? I will say it's pure hell to have rare pairs, especially when they're actually canon in your franchise of choice :crybaby:

View Original Postjcmoorehead wrote:I dunno though, fandom now seems to focus mostly on negative aspects than just... enjoying the damn thing and it is exhausting.


Yeah, exactly! Why that's so hard for people to grasp this (or maybe as you said, those attitudes have always been there?) I'll never understand. I once had a Tumblr in 2011-2012 for general nerdy anime purposes and through that alone I saw various weird in-fighting or even politics(?!?!) when it...didn't seem necessary at all? (Needless to say, I deactivated after a few months.) Then in 2017 I made a Tumblr for a MGS fandom event, but there was much more traction on Twitter than Tumblr so I deactivated it sometime after the event finished. (Oh, well.)

View Original PostGob Hobblin wrote:Social media has become too much of a minefield to deal with, frankly. I keep regretting getting an FB page because of it, but I'm too linked in to people now to delete it.


Ugh, right? :irked: I have a Facebook (That I actually deleted once, but then reactivated because my dad wanted to keep in touch) for Friends/Family, so I'm on it as a means to keep in touch with them but that's about it. Seeing so many political/religious/etc posts is just tiring when that's not how I want to connect with everyone, you know? I honestly wish I could just keep in touch with people via email like the "old days", but that's just not an option in today's world :sweatdrop:
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Postby jcmoorehead » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:44 am

I enjoy using Facebook/Twitter. I do keep on meaning to use them more and interact with you guys when I can but I'm always too shy/nervous to do so. I am on the EGF Discord now though but need to start talking more whilst in it.

I did have a Tumblr but I don't use it anymore. With my stuff I just enjoy writing, browsing here, chatting to the friends I do have and that is that really. I'm not interested in being pulled into drama.

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:49 am

See, I actually checked out the EGF Discord this weekend, and while it was fun to catch up with everyone, it felt incredibly hard for me to get into. Compared to IRC where shooting the breeze felt like second nature, but now that's deader than a door-nail with activity in there. (I'll miss you, Fuyutsuki-bot and your LOLis!)

Yeah, I'm flabbergasted by that too :shrug: I guess I'm just an "old fart" that prefers one-on-one chatting, these days. Which is why in that sense, Twitter is a blessing, but again, I don't see that "friendly" vibe that I used to, back in 2011-2016 or so. Japanese fan artists are always kind and funny to chat with, at least.

I wonder if maybe I'm the one who's changed, and it's confusing as hell to me.
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Postby silvermoonlight » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:06 pm

View Original PostSailor Star Dust wrote:silvermoonlight: Mh, EGF is such a blessing compared to those other sites, huh?

About shipping overall, maybe it is just an age thing? When I was younger I was a lot more...hardcore in my viewpoint (Heck if I know why. General fandom defensiveness about MAH FAVORITES!11!, maybe??), but these days I can easily read fic/look at fanart of different pairings and appreciate the cuteness, even if they're not my favorite 'ships, you know? I will say it's pure hell to have rare pairs, especially when they're actually canon in your franchise of choice :crybaby:


In all honesty this place is paradise compared to there and I've heard a lot of people quit tumblr because the stress both impacts there daily lives and makes there mental health much worse as well as the negativity which can effect some peoples view of others in sociality or make them think that everyone is their enemy and are out to get them.

That is an interesting point that I had not considered as when I was young I was proud over my ships the difference I saw in tumblr was some of these people are in my age bracket and older and these older fans are the ones the younger fans look to as the moral pillar, so when you have a warped moral pillar you are going to get real issues. I saw that the most in the Once Up On A Time fandom granted I didn't watch the show it just appeared in my feed a lot due to other members and watching the constant fall out with older members claiming that they had an entitlement to a paring was jarring as hell.

(If the mods want separate this thread feel free)
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My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:38 pm

View Original Postsilvermoonlight wrote:In all honesty this place is paradise compared to there and I've heard a lot of people quit tumblr because the stress both impacts there daily lives and makes there mental health much worse as well as the negativity which can effect some peoples view of others in sociality or make them think that everyone is their enemy and are out to get them.


Regarding mental health and all that, I know a popular thing on Twitter is to have locked vent accounts. I dabbled in one once to chat with some close friends (rather than vent) but I saw sooo much ridiculous fandom drama and unpleasantness "behind closed doors" from some other accounts that it seriously affected my mood. I deleted the account in maybe a week, I think :sweatdrop:

About multi-shipping: For most characters I like them with a particular character and that's it, though I do have 2-3 characters (from MGS) that I think multi-shipping actually fits them in that 'multi-faceted', relationships aren't static, way. (Cough, one of 'em is Big Boss.) For people to get so...uppity and defensive about shipping in general is just bizarre to me because it's anything but serious, you know?

(If the mods want separate this thread feel free)


I don't seem to have any Admin powers, but I'll probably split this to avoid clutter (if everyone else agrees) since it's such an interesting subject on its own ^_^
~Take care of yourself, I need you~


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