Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

Moderators: New Moderators, Board Staff

Ekonomi122
Embryo
Posts: 11
Joined: Nov 13, 2017

Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Ekonomi122 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:05 am

What you guys opinion about Shikinami relationship Shinji ? Do you guys think their relationship is better than Soryu ? I vote Shinikami because she have better relationship with Shinji than Soryu . Soryu relationship with Shinji is more hostile relationship .

Asuka'sBigBrother
Tunniel
User avatar
Age: 17
Posts: 184
Joined: Oct 20, 2017
Location: Nueva Yorke
Gender: Male
Contact:

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Asuka'sBigBrother » Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:37 am

I vote Soryu because she's far deeper character whose relationship with Shinji deepens the exploration of Shinji as a character.

IMO, the goal of a relationship in a story is to further develop or explore the characters involved in a relationship. A character with depth offers more to the audience in a relationship than a character without it.

Shipping isn't relevant to me, what makes a good story is.
Just a big bro looking out for sistah

Mess with this crew, and I'll give you a blister

Joseki
Sahaquiel
Sahaquiel
User avatar
Age: 22
Posts: 608
Joined: Dec 27, 2016
Location: Italy
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Joseki » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:06 am

I know that a lot of people feel strongly about this matter but personally I don't really have a preference, both relationships intrigued me during my first watch and both work well considering the different formats and time constraints present in the TV show and the new movies.

If had to chose maybe I'd say Shikinami-Shinji because I loved the different take on the bed scene, I never cared much about the original version.

Anno's bait worked for me  SPOILER: Show
— What was the impetus for the change?

Anno: The big thing was the comments made by Makki (Director Kazuya Tsurumaki’s pet name). For this, we can’t make films just by summarizing the TV series. He also said, I want Asuka to have a film-like role. At this rate, she will just be making an appearance - she provides no drama vis-a-vis Shinji, the protagonist; she is not involved. Furthermore, As a story, it’s not different enough from the original series - all these in succession. He further said, Isn’t a change as drastic as having Asuka pilot Unit-03 necessary? I think, because this was a major, fundamental change, opinion was divided when I researched the views of a number of staff members. (Ikki) Todoroki, in particular, was tremendously opposed. After thinking about it, I ultimately adopted Tsurumaki’s proposal and decided to change the pilot of Unit-03. That was the sixth draft of the script. It was finished following the 2007 new year, on January 8th. In this draft, the test pilot was simply changed from Touji to Asuka, [and the reason for it - Mari, the new pilot, is reassigned to NERV HQ from Europe, and Asuka will be taken off of Unit-02, so she volunteers - was really just improvised. ?] The change of test pilot was forced into the draft, with the characters and situations left unaltered.

So, naturally, I received, and agreed with, a proposal memo sent out by Tsurumaki, which said, We have to provide Shinji, as well as the audience, with the same degree of shock and sense of loss as when Touji was lost in the TV series. For that reason, by boldly portraying Asuka as a good character, I hope to greatly convey that sense of loss. Because of that, I wanted to have Asuka pilot Unit-03 in order to do something for Rei, and Shinji, and others - something for other people. As Tsurumaki put it, it’s like a death flag is raised. As a result, Asuka piloting Unit-03 ended up being made into the peak of her drama. I changed various parts of the script in accordance with this. For example, Asuka’s impetus for piloting Unit-03 would connect with the story of Rei [learning to cook and?] preparing a dinner party for Shinji and Gendou. It seemed like these things, as well as Asuka’s character, dialogue, and so on, had gradually become solidified.
「希望は残っているよ。どんな時にもね」

29/07/2017

Cybermat47
Ramiel
Ramiel
User avatar
Age: 18
Posts: 345
Joined: Jun 20, 2017
Location: NSW, Australia
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Cybermat47 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:29 am

The relationship between Shikinami and Shinji is better from their point of view, but Soryu and Shinji is better for us, the audience.
My fanfics:
Evangelion 2.9: You Will (Not) Survive
Godzilla VS Evangelion: Who Will Know?

"I have to count my blessings, I have to learn my lessons, my fate is in the balance, I must go on believing!"
- Fate by Shirō Sagisu

C.T.1290
Shamshel
Shamshel
Age: 27
Posts: 281
Joined: Apr 22, 2017
Location: USA
Gender: Male
Contact:

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby C.T.1290 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:10 pm

I'm starting to think that Asuka isn't the right girl for Shinji, Soryu or Shikinami. Both of them have had a bad relationship with him. Asuka in the original series seem to despised him for personal reasons and is quite difficult to put up with, whereas Shikinami has the shared hatred of him as everyone else does in 3.0 for causing the Third and Fourth Impact.

In the end, she's just not right for him. And I don't think Shinji would want to be around her either because of how and what she is.
"Who dares to summon the master of masters, the deliverer of darkness, the Shogun of sorrow, Aku!?"-Aku

"KONO DIO DA!"-Dio

pwhodges
A Lilin in Wonderland
A Lilin in Wonderland
User avatar
Age: 71
Posts: 9539
Joined: Nov 18, 2012
Location: Oxford, UK
Contact:

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby pwhodges » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:15 pm

View Original PostC.T.1290 wrote:I'm starting to think that Asuka isn't the right girl for Shinji, Soryu or Shikinami. Both of them have had a bad relationship with him.

Still, since it's not a romance series anyway, this is no particular disadvantage.
"Being human, having your health; that's what's important." (from: Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi )
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?" (from: The Eccentric Family )
Avatar: Sad, sad Shinji... (details); Past avatars.
Afterwards... my post-Q Evangelion fanfic (discussion)

Ray
Elder God
Elder God
User avatar
Age: 24
Posts: 6485
Joined: Feb 10, 2014
Location: USA
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Ray » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:58 pm

As of the events of 3.33? The relationship they could have had, is gone forever. What Shinji did in that movie, On top of the 14 year time gap which was completely corrosive to whatever they could have had. Shikinami will never have romantic interest in him. Even if she can somehow come around to forgiving him for what he did, romance is not happening.

Best case scenario? At the end of Final, she accepts Shinji's apology then they go their separate ways amicably.
I’ll escape now from this world, from the world of Jean Valjean, Jean Valjean is nothing now! Another story must begin!
Avatar: "There's a Starman, waiting in the sky. He'd like to come and meet me, but he thinks he'd blow my mind."
Phew, I’m not tense anymore… now I’m just miserable.
People say "be yourself" but that's bad advice, if we were all to "be ourselves" many of us would stop wearing clothes. -Chuckman

Asuka'sBigBrother
Tunniel
User avatar
Age: 17
Posts: 184
Joined: Oct 20, 2017
Location: Nueva Yorke
Gender: Male
Contact:

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Asuka'sBigBrother » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:02 am

The relationship between Shikinami and Shinji is better from their point of view,


Not really sure how you've come to the conclusion that they're in a better place after 3.0, where Shinji is still nihlistic, has regressed rather than progressed, lacks the will to live, isn't expressing himself in any way, and where Asuka is physically abusing him, than after EOE where both had found the will to live, Asuka is caressing him, and Shinji opens himself up.

Irrelevant of whether you prefer one relationship or the other, how is their relationship in a better place as of Rebuild than it was in EOE?


romance is not happening

Yeah, simply put, if Anno wants to have their relationship repair itself and turn into a romantic, it's perfectly possible for him to do so. What if Anno decides that their relationship can be repaired, the n the whole, "romance is not happening," is shown to be premature. In a story there are infinite possibilities for where a character's story arc can go. While you can certainly argue a romantic relationship is not likely, would be a bad storytelling decision, ect, the idea that it's impossible is absurd. Hell, if Anno wanted, he could write a plausible romance between Shinji and Fututsuki. I certainly wouldn't support that story telling decision, but that doesn't mean he can't do it.

Whether they have a romantic relationship comes down to what Anno wants. If that ends up being the end point he sets for their arc, he has a million ways to get there.
Just a big bro looking out for sistah

Mess with this crew, and I'll give you a blister

Blockio
Adam
User avatar
Posts: 82
Joined: Dec 03, 2017

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Blockio » Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:45 am

View Original PostAsuka'sBigBrother wrote:Not really sure how you've come to the conclusion that they're in a better place after 3.0, where Shinji is still nihlistic, has regressed rather than progressed, lacks the will to live, isn't expressing himself in any way, and where Asuka is physically abusing him, than after EOE where both had found the will to live, Asuka is caressing him, and Shinji opens himself up.

Irrelevant of whether you prefer one relationship or the other, how is their relationship in a better place as of Rebuild than it was in EOE?


The main argument here would probably be that they didnt activelytry to kill each other (yet?) (aside from maybe the final fight in Q, which to me felt more like "get him out of the Eva before he does anything ridiculously stupid"). And the beach scene from EoE can mean anything really, since it is so short and unexplained. Now Im not saying that youre automatically wrong with your interpretation, just that I really dont believe that anyone aside from Anno himself can definitely tell how the relationship between Asuka and Shinji was after EoE (maybe not even he, seeing how the "Disgusting"/"I feel sick" line was created)
EDIT: Also, lets not forget the catchphrase of this forum
Neon Genesis Evangelion: the show that makes you wonder, "is this fanservice, or a subtle hint into the psychology of a character and the nature of their relationships with others? ~ Cybermat47

Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ sadly not Mari in Q (Joseki)

VUX
Lilith
Posts: 120
Joined: Jan 16, 2018
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby VUX » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:57 pm

Their relationship can best be quoted with the song lyrics "I hate you i love you"
"When life gives you problems..., get into the robot!"

pwhodges
A Lilin in Wonderland
A Lilin in Wonderland
User avatar
Age: 71
Posts: 9539
Joined: Nov 18, 2012
Location: Oxford, UK
Contact:

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby pwhodges » Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:32 pm

View Original PostVUX wrote:"I hate you i love you"

That even applies to Shinji loving and hating himself:

SPOILER: Show
Image
"Being human, having your health; that's what's important." (from: Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi )
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?" (from: The Eccentric Family )
Avatar: Sad, sad Shinji... (details); Past avatars.
Afterwards... my post-Q Evangelion fanfic (discussion)

C.T.1290
Shamshel
Shamshel
Age: 27
Posts: 281
Joined: Apr 22, 2017
Location: USA
Gender: Male
Contact:

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby C.T.1290 » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:15 am

View Original Postpwhodges wrote:That even applies to Shinji loving and hating himself:

SPOILER: Show
Image

So I take that's Shinji's and Asuka's relationship in a nutshell?
"Who dares to summon the master of masters, the deliverer of darkness, the Shogun of sorrow, Aku!?"-Aku

"KONO DIO DA!"-Dio

pwhodges
A Lilin in Wonderland
A Lilin in Wonderland
User avatar
Age: 71
Posts: 9539
Joined: Nov 18, 2012
Location: Oxford, UK
Contact:

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby pwhodges » Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:50 am

It applies to us all in some degree; the main difference is whether we acknowledge and accept it.
"Being human, having your health; that's what's important." (from: Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi )
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?" (from: The Eccentric Family )
Avatar: Sad, sad Shinji... (details); Past avatars.
Afterwards... my post-Q Evangelion fanfic (discussion)

Joseki
Sahaquiel
Sahaquiel
User avatar
Age: 22
Posts: 608
Joined: Dec 27, 2016
Location: Italy
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Joseki » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:35 pm

View Original PostVUX wrote:Their relationship can best be quoted with the song lyrics "I hate you i love you"


Their relationship is True Love by Pink

Sometimes I hate every single stupid word you say
Sometimes I wanna slap you in your whole face (whoa oh oh)
There's no one quite like you, you push all my buttons down
I know life would suck without you (whoa oh oh)
At the same time, I wanna hug you
I wanna wrap my hands around your neck
You're an asshole but I love you
And you make me so mad, I ask myself
Why I'm still here, or where could I go
You're the only love I've ever known


There's even some chocking in the lyrics :lol:
「希望は残っているよ。どんな時にもね」

29/07/2017

Shinji Ikari Expy
Embryo
User avatar
Posts: 15
Joined: Aug 27, 2017
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Shinji Ikari Expy » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:45 pm

Soryu seems closer to Shinji and more likely to have a relationship with him. Whether this a good idea is a separate topic that has gotten plenty of debate here.

Shikinami in Q seemed so much more mature than Shinji. Maybe she's not exactly a 28-year-old, but she seemed like an adult who prioritized her duty over her own feelings; he still seemed like a needy child. There's too much distance between them for a romantic relationship, and any friendship they have would be a sort of mentor-protege feel to it because of the difference in life experience.

VUX
Lilith
Posts: 120
Joined: Jan 16, 2018
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby VUX » Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:51 am

She seems to hate Shinji the same way my race despises humans
"When life gives you problems..., get into the robot!"

The Cruel
Tunniel
User avatar
Age: 23
Posts: 198
Joined: Feb 19, 2014
Gender: Male

Re: Shikinami or Soryu relationship with Shinji ?

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby The Cruel » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:44 am

As much as I would like them to be together, I wouldn't mind when they can't be. So much happened between them and so many mistakes were made and chances weren't taken, that they can't really think from themselves to be worth being loved and worthy for each other.

The only thing that's best for them, is to confront their problems and mistakes they made. They can't ignore them any longer.

When Asuka doesn't want a relationship with someone, then she doesn't need one. This won't change who she is whether she wants Shinji or not.

Those 14 years since Matsushiro and 3I she spend with, she should've had enough time to think about who Shinji is for her.

How it ends between them is their decision. Shinji wouldn't believe to be forgiven by her anyway. And Maris hopes for them to be together are about to cease.
I carry out things right to the end. No. Matter. What.


Return to “Rebuild of Evangelion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest