Evangelion 3.0 Speculation [1]

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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BWAHAHA he ho ha hee ho! BE)

Postby Alaska Slim » Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:37 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:If Kaworu is a clone of Gendo, there's so much epigenetic wackiness going on that no resemblance remains. How odd.

Kawrou is a clone, but his features were altered via a Joker chip.

Let a prog knife vibrate up against his neck for a few minutes, it's the only way to be sure. :chainsaw:

Mark Hamill as Kawrou... It would be serendipity I'd say.



@topic: For some reason, I'm liking the theories that Asuka may be involved with the key, it would certainly be an interesting twist for her to become the plot device instead of Rei, and rather good way to keep her somehow relevant to the plot.
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Re: BWAHAHA he ho ha hee ho! BE)

Postby Brainman » Tue Feb 21, 2012 9:55 pm

View Original PostAlaska Slim wrote:@topic: For some reason, I'm liking the theories that Asuka may be involved with the key, it would certainly be an interesting twist for her to become the plot device instead of Rei, and rather good way to keep her somehow relevant to the plot.


While I'm all for getting Asuka more front and center in the story, I don't think it has to do with the key. My reasoning being if she was somehow integral to the key's use Gendo probably wouldn't be so ready to count her as disposable in the Unit 03 incident. Unless he somehow foresaw it and knew she would get infiltrated by an angel so that the key could work on an angel/human hybrid or somethin'. Then of course he'd be runner up behind Emperor Palpatine in the "I Have Foreseen Literally Every Turn of Event Except for My Ultimate Demise" contest.
Why do they even want the Loc-Nar? All it does is melt you.

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Re: BWAHAHA he ho ha hee ho! BE)

Postby deeRez » Tue Feb 21, 2012 11:38 pm

View Original PostBrainman wrote:While I'm all for getting Asuka more front and center in the story, I don't think it has to do with the key. My reasoning being if she was somehow integral to the key's use Gendo probably wouldn't be so ready to count her as disposable in the Unit 03 incident. Unless he somehow foresaw it and knew she would get infiltrated by an angel so that the key could work on an angel/human hybrid or somethin'. Then of course he'd be runner up behind Emperor Palpatine in the "I Have Foreseen Literally Every Turn of Event Except for My Ultimate Demise" contest.


I want to see Gendo fail, and not just to fail at the end, but in the steps before as well.

An all-seeing Gendo kills the immersion.
In and of itself, self-evident.

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Postby chaosakita » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:18 am

I don't really like the idea of Kaworu being Gendou's clone. For one thing, as people have already said, they don't look anything alike. Also, if Gendou is still an accountant during 2I, I really doubt he would've been used as the donor.
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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:53 am

Ahhhh Rebuild and speculation. A relationship which will never end. Lol.

All this recent speculation takes me back to when the trailer for the first film was released:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaWj2mCm5TU&feature=BFa&list=FLirvbuYMnOmHNVKZc6_Qx_A&lf=BFp

Twas a funny time. A time when many hypothesized that Rebuild's LCL was colored black.

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Re: BWAHAHA he ho ha hee ho! BE)

Postby Brainman » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:03 am

View Original PostdeeRez wrote:I want to see Gendo fail, and not just to fail at the end, but in the steps before as well.

An all-seeing Gendo kills the immersion.


Yeah, it's a boring way to write. So I don't think Gendo knew that Unit 03 would get infected, and so I don't think Asuka is necessary for his key thing.

What still racks my brain is the bit with the Rei clones. It's the one thing I can't imagine anything for. Who activates a bunch of Rei's? How can they all be alive at once? What the heck are they supposed to do? Are they different "aspects" of Rei? Parts that need to be recollected to turn them back into Super Rei?
Why do they even want the Loc-Nar? All it does is melt you.

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Postby Warren Peace » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:30 am

Rei is wearing her uniform from Episode 26's fantasy sequence, so maybe that's from one also.

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Postby Jornophelanthas » Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:37 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:The two really look nothing alike, and considering how sparse anime characters are in terms of facial features that's saying a lot.

While it was fun to speculate on the repercussions of Kaworu being related to Gendo, I must agree with Reichu's reality check. While I do believe Kaworu's DNA is acquired from another character, a much more likely candidate would be Keel Lorenz.
(We do know he exists, because during Kaworu's conversation with one of the SEELE members at the end of 1.0, this voice was identified as Keel's in the end credits. But we won't know about any physical resemblance between Keel and Kaworu until he actually makes a physical appearance in the Rebuild continuity.)

View Original PostdeeRez wrote:I want to see Gendo fail, and not just to fail at the end, but in the steps before as well.

An all-seeing Gendo kills the immersion.

I somewhat disagree. I want to see Gendo fail at the steps before reaching his final goal, but I want him to reach his final goal. After all, what point is there in having Gendo pursue his own agenda independent from SEELE, if his agenda is never a serious contender for the final outcome?
No, I am actually rooting for Gendo's plan to succeed. And I am hoping that, despite Gendo's ruthless methods, the goal he has been working towards will actually be a very altruistic, desirable situation.
Additionally, what I am also hoping is that, after Gendo has overcome all obstacles, he will somehow come to the realization (through some involvement by Rei and/or Shinji) that his about-to-be-realized-ideal-world is inferior to a reality-where-things-can-still-go-wrong, and he will sabotage his own plan as a result.
Preferably by voluntarily having a contact experiment with Unit-01, so he can join Yui in its core for the rest of eternity.

I am all for the characters overcoming their flaws, and a scenario like this would seem like a worthy end for the likes of Gendo, i.e. he "runs away" towards Yui, but he leaves the world intact for Shinji.

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Postby Reichu » Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:42 am

Jorno: The 'genetic donor' origins of Kaworu are from NGE and could well not hold true in NME at all. The only reason for NME "Kaworu is Gendo clone" speculation is because of the "sup, Dad" line on the Moon. Trying to pin it on Kiel doesn't really address the original puzzle.
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Re: BWAHAHA he ho ha hee ho! BE)

Postby deeRez » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:23 pm

View Original PostBrainman wrote:What still racks my brain is the bit with the Rei clones. It's the one thing I can't imagine anything for. Who activates a bunch of Rei's? How can they all be alive at once? What the heck are they supposed to do? Are they different "aspects" of Rei? Parts that need to be recollected to turn them back into Super Rei?


In Eva-TV the other Reis were soulless shells. In Rebuild, they may have decided that Rei's soul could be split, making all the shells concurrently alive.

Rei's soul having the ability to split would explain the split of Unit-01's soul and pilot Rei's soul, which Eva-TV didn't really go into detail about.

View Original PostReichu wrote:The two really look nothing alike, and considering how sparse anime characters are in terms of facial features that's saying a lot.


According to Eva-TV, Kaworu got his DNA from a random person in third impact, in that Antarctica explosion.

And Gendo wasn't there during the impact, since he knew what was going to happen so he stayed away. So if Rebuild follows that line, it's likely that whoever Kaworu's a clone of is a random dead scientist, and insignificant to the story line. (Unless it's a clone of Misato's dad by random chance? The drama possibilities in Rebuild!)

Though, since Gendo did cause the impact, it still leaves him as a "father" for having a hand in Kaworu's creation.

Now this is all if Rebuild follows the notion of Kaworu being created by pure chance. Something tells me, since he's instrumental to SEELE's plan, that this will be changed to make it seem less than "SEELE got lucky" and more towards "SEELE planned it". I have a feeling they're going to change this so that the Adam fetus (with soul intact) (from Second Impact) is brought to the pre-NERV lab by SEELE, for Gendo and his team to investigate.

There I suspect pre-NERV'll learn to split Adam's soul from the body, to create Kaworu. SEELE might then decide to take away Kaworu from NERV, with Gendo deciding to use what they learned to create Rei.

It'd also explain baby/teen-at-birth Kaworu meeting baby Shinji early on.
In and of itself, self-evident.

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Postby Jornophelanthas » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:34 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Jorno: The 'genetic donor' origins of Kaworu are from NGE and could well not hold true in NME at all. The only reason for NME "Kaworu is Gendo clone" speculation is because of the "sup, Dad" line on the Moon. Trying to pin it on Kiel doesn't really address the original puzzle.

I am not basing my speculation on anything from NGE, except perhaps the expectation that Kaworu is a human-Angel hybrid, since that was sort of his defining feature. Rather, it's based on the following things:

- Kaworu has a lack of pigment, just like Rei (paper-white skin, pale hair, red eyes). Which emphasizes a similarity between them.
And we already know that something is up with Rei, because she (1) has an uncanny resemblance to Gendo's dead wife, (2a) claims not be able to live outside of a glass tube, just like the fish, and (2b) is later seen floating inside a glass tube, while (3) her behaviour is quite odd, and (4) there is no record of her past.
Oh right, and (5) we see a number of clones of her in the 3.0 preview.

- Kaworu appears to be more than human, what with being able to survive and be comfortable in the moon's atmosphere.

- Kaworu appears to enjoy a degree of trust from SEELE/Kiel, since they have a conversation as (near-)equals at the end of 1.0, discussing things that Shinji (an probably even Gendo) is in the dark about.

Finally:
View Original PostReichu wrote:An aged Kaworu would probably have a broader chin and longer face, but should successfully graduate to "pretty man" status

Image
Image

So what if you age him up a little more?

Image
Image

I admit, not convincing. But they're not dissimilar enough to dismiss out of hand.

Edit: Cleaned up image size.
Last edited by Jornophelanthas on Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:25 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Postby Final Messenger » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:04 pm

A doujin artist’s speculation
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Postby Na7e » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:19 pm

Didn't they say Asuka was free from physical contamination. Just they never mention mental contamination. As for the eye didn't the story boards say she'd have Heterochromia with a blue eye and a red eye.

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Postby Bagheera » Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:44 pm

View Original PostFinal Messenger wrote:A doujin artist’s speculation


That right there is some brilliant speculation! :asuka_thumbsup:
Last edited by Bagheera on Wed Feb 22, 2012 7:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby Fireball » Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:59 pm

View Original PostFinal Messenger wrote:A doujin artist’s speculation
SPOILER: Show
Image
Image


I'm okay with this.
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Postby Reichu » Wed Feb 22, 2012 7:02 pm

View Original PostNa7e wrote:As for the eye didn't the story boards say she'd have Heterochromia with a blue eye and a red eye.

Sounds like fan mischief to me. (The storyboards wouldn't note anything about the color of an eye that's covered, since that information is useless to animators.)
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Postby Brainman » Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:11 pm

That Asuka comic is adorable. I like how it starts out saying "This is what I think Asuka will be like in Q" and it basically amounts to "she shoots a beam." Personality? Temperament? Emotions? Nah, screw that. Beam.

Then it says to keep it a secret. Like there's this huge explosion she caused, but uh, keep it under your hat, Maya. The Asuka-Beam shouldn't go public yet.
Why do they even want the Loc-Nar? All it does is melt you.

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Postby Bagheera » Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:15 am

View Original PostBrainman wrote:That Asuka comic is adorable. I like how it starts out saying "This is what I think Asuka will be like in Q" and it basically amounts to "she shoots a beam." Personality? Temperament? Emotions? Nah, screw that. Beam.

Then it says to keep it a secret. Like there's this huge explosion she caused, but uh, keep it under your hat, Maya. The Asuka-Beam shouldn't go public yet.


And of course, Ritsuko's there denying reality as always. Ever notice how she does that? She always says "impossible" when she watches something happen (meaning it's obviously possible). Misato, by contrast, says "impossible" when something fishy's going on. It's actually kinda interesting when you keep a running tally of how and when they use the word.
For my post-3I fic, go here.
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People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby Brainman » Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:56 am

^
Well, it's a pretty easy way to tell the audience something crazy is happening. "What, Frieza has ANOTHER transformation? THAT CAN'T BE!"

In all seriousness, if Asuka has super powers in 3.0 I don't know what I'll do. Probably spill my cheetos on the floor. That sounds about right.
Why do they even want the Loc-Nar? All it does is melt you.

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Postby Bagheera » Thu Feb 23, 2012 3:02 am

View Original PostBrainman wrote:^
Well, it's a pretty easy way to tell the audience something crazy is happening. "What, Frieza has ANOTHER transformation? THAT CAN'T BE!"


Sure. I just fine the denial on the one hand and suspicion on the other interesting; it's very in keeping with each lady's respective character arcs.
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.


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