EoE Sandbox Scene, Asuka Scenes?

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Postby ZapX » Tue May 27, 2008 12:45 am

There's also a sandbox scene in Gunbuster. Anno did it first.

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Postby universalperson » Tue May 27, 2008 8:24 am

So maybe Anno was just being self-referential with the sandbox scene.

Makes more sense if you consider the whole "Anno is Shinji" theory...
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Postby Xard » Tue May 27, 2008 8:50 am

universalperson wrote:So maybe Anno was just being self-referential with the sandbox scene.

Makes more sense if you consider the whole "Anno is Shinji" theory...


Oh, it's not theory. But nor is it that simple at all. Both Gendo and (believe it or not) Misato show traits of Anno too. So even though Shinji is his avatar in the show they're not entirely same

And I don't think it is self-referential. Playgrounds just are big part of Anno's auteurism. Prominent scenes have happened in playground in Gunbuster, End of Evangelion, Love&Pop and Shiki-Jitsu (esp. in Shiki-Jitsu), maybe in Kare Kano too (can't remember)

Only things that overwrites playgrounds as Anno's trademark are trains and phone wires etc. that are very prominent in Evangelion and Shiki-Jisu

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Postby Eva Yojimbo » Tue May 27, 2008 9:23 am

Xard wrote:Anno's trademark are trains and phone wires etc.
Trains are prominent in all Japanese cinema and go back to Ozu and probably further than that. Watch Hou Hsiao-hsien's Cafe Lumiere and everything in the film is centered around trains.

Enki v.2 wrote:Meh. The scenery is such thinly veiled sexual imagery that it's the first thing noticeable. The hills are breasts (the floodlights become nipples at times), the setting sun is the head, the other set of hills are legs. As for what it means, I won't bother debating. It's just one of Anno's freudian fanwank triggers. It's probably either something very simple that we're all overthinking, or it's something that Anno never decided on an official meaning for and just stuck it in to get otaku's pantsu in a twist.
I don't think the imagery is sexual but merely... womanly? I mean, your descriptions aren't off, per say, but I don't think Anno is exploring sexuality here but the relationship of mother and son, creator VS created.

This scene is one I've loved and admired for a long time because of how much Anno is able to say or suggest with so little. It's very easy for symbolism to become trite and meaningless in the sense that they don't say enough of relevance in relation to the time spent using them. The opposite is true here, it's able to condense a lot of ideas into a scene of real brevity. I've never really commented on it too heavily and that's because even though I've had a lot of varying theories I've yet to be able to unify it all into a whole (like I eventually was able to with the hand motif). I will try to cover some things here:

The odd "sexual imagery" nobody seems to notice is the swing or, in particular, the shape of the swing set and Shinji's placement. I always find it odd people get the mountain/breasts, sun/head, etc. but miss the swing's placement. Essentially, it's birth imagery. Shinji being the created, with his creator watching on. Then Shinji "creates" the sand/Nerv castle. The created is creating. This creation can be linked to a number of things, in particular his persona he tried to create through his Eva experience.

The swing seems to cover the passage of time and emotion. But interestingly there's another element that I think is missed, and that's its correlative to Shinji's clenching/unclenching hands. The nature of a swing is to go back and forth, which can easily be seen as a metaphor for indecision between choices. Only when Shinji destroys his own creation (and this is a clever metaphor for instrumentality, the destruction of the persona and his individualism, through a creation of Nerv itself) does the swing stop. The decision has been made, and its one of death. The sun echoes this by setting.

Finally, Shinji cries, and begins rebuilding. This, to me, is foreshadowing his future decision, and even One More Final, which all can be summed up by "The fate of destruction is also the joy of rebirth". In this case it's both literal and figurative.

[/Ramble]
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Postby Xard » Tue May 27, 2008 9:36 am

Eva Yojimbo wrote:
Xard wrote:Anno's trademark are trains and phone wires etc.
Trains are prominent in all Japanese cinema and go back to Ozu and probably further than that. Watch Hou Hsiao-hsien's Cafe Lumiere and everything in the film is centered around trains.


Sure, but Anno really seems to try fit in as much trains as possible. Esp. in pillow shots. And when they really don't have anything to do with anything (Love&Pop)

And no one likes making shots of those poles etc. as much as Anno does

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Postby Eva Yojimbo » Tue May 27, 2008 9:59 am

Xard wrote:Sure, but Anno really seems to try fit in as much trains as possible. Esp. in pillow shots.
In NGE it makes a lot of sense though considering the whole "Shinji's personal hell and beginnings" motif associated with trains. I also had a short exposition on "why trains" I wrote and recited for the audio commentary of ep. 4. I'll have to see if I can find that because I thought it covered the topic really cogently.
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We're all adrift on the stormy seas of Evangelion, desperately trying to gather what flotsam can be snatched from the gale into a somewhat seaworthy interpretation so that we can at last reach the shores of reason and respite. - ObsessiveMathsFreak
Jimbo has posted enough to be considered greater than or equal to everyone, and or synonymous with the concept of 'everyone'. - Muggy
I've seen so many changeful years, / to Earth I am a stranger grown: / I wander in the ways of men, / alike unknowing and unknown: / Unheard, unpitied, unrelieved, / I bear alone my load of care; / For silent, low, on beds of dust, / Lie all that would my sorrows share. - Robert Burns' Lament for James

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Postby Shin-seiki » Tue May 27, 2008 10:14 am

ZapalacX wrote:There's also a sandbox scene in Gunbuster. Anno did it first.
Good catch, tho I think the Gunbuster scene corresponds more precisely with the scene with Asuka and Hikari at the playground in #18 (two friends on swing set in playground at sunset, etc...) There is also a similar scene in KareKano, btw.

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Postby ZapX » Tue May 27, 2008 11:26 am

Yeah, I would agree with that. The scene is more akin to the Asuka/Hikari "what do you think of Suzuhara" scene (just look at the second screen). Takami does look like Shinji in Eoe though.
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"I have a fetish for naked women with stigmata playing ping pong in the mud. Is there a name for that?" -Kaiser O-Ornette-dono-sama

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Postby sadsadshinji » Wed May 28, 2008 12:04 am

How exactly is the swing set imagery? I always looked at it suspiciously, but never really got anything out of it. I suppose the idea of a sandbox fits the womb though...

I also agree very much with the idea of Shinji's whole work with the castle as a foreshadowing of his actions in EoE. In my view, the entire scene is really a shortened version of the entire series in some way.

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Postby ZapX » Wed May 28, 2008 1:16 am

Again, I suggest the search function. I specifically remember ANF threads about this shit. Though that was a few years ago.
ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ"Stop watching anime. it makes you think all girls are incredibly hot and shy, and there are 10 that all want your boner which just isn't true." -Brik-aniki

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"I have a fetish for naked women with stigmata playing ping pong in the mud. Is there a name for that?" -Kaiser O-Ornette-dono-sama

“Don’t do that; that was probably hooker money.” -SSD on me holding money with my mouth

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Postby Eva Yojimbo » Wed May 28, 2008 10:09 am

sadsadshinji wrote:How exactly is the swing set imagery?
Well... the obvious answer is it's an image that is completely out of place in terms of what one would expect at this point, so it must have some relevance. As for what it represents, well, that's the discussion (and there's been a lot of interpretations given).
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Jimbo has posted enough to be considered greater than or equal to everyone, and or synonymous with the concept of 'everyone'. - Muggy
I've seen so many changeful years, / to Earth I am a stranger grown: / I wander in the ways of men, / alike unknowing and unknown: / Unheard, unpitied, unrelieved, / I bear alone my load of care; / For silent, low, on beds of dust, / Lie all that would my sorrows share. - Robert Burns' Lament for James

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Postby Squirrel Ninja » Wed May 28, 2008 6:01 pm

I just noticed in the episode, "A choice of Life" when Asuka has her conversation with Hikari. After Asuka says, "he [Shinji] doesn't know how to relate to people," the camera cuts to a sandbox.

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Postby Xard » Wed May 28, 2008 6:26 pm

Squirrel Ninja wrote:I just noticed in the episode, "A choice of Life" when Asuka has her conversation with Hikari. After Asuka says, "he [Shinji] doesn't know how to relate to people," the camera cuts to a sandbox.


Well, this is more a coincidence

click

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Postby sadsadshinji » Thu May 29, 2008 1:36 am

I noticed that scene and disqualified any links for the reason that the sandboxes are rather different (setting, meaning?), though I suppose the sandbox in Asuka's conversation could refer to Shinji's loneliness/lack of social ability? The image of a deserted sandbox does seem kind of desolate.

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Postby Squirrel Ninja » Thu May 29, 2008 10:53 am

Xard wrote:
Squirrel Ninja wrote:I just noticed in the episode, "A choice of Life" when Asuka has her conversation with Hikari. After Asuka says, "he [Shinji] doesn't know how to relate to people," the camera cuts to a sandbox.


Well, this is more a coincidence

click

touché it's an intresting coincidence though.

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Postby Xard » Thu May 29, 2008 1:18 pm

When one adds word "interesting" or such before word coincidence he/she implies there's somethin more to it

So I suggest you don't do it

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Postby Squirrel Ninja » Thu May 29, 2008 2:28 pm

Xard wrote:When one adds word "interesting" or such before word coincidence he/she implies there's somethin more to it

Caught me.

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Postby Ornette » Fri Jun 06, 2008 11:37 pm

Bump, I summarized that Sandbox Sequence thread in the wiki:

http://evageeks.org/FGP/Sandbox_Sequence

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Postby Eva Yojimbo » Fri Jun 06, 2008 11:56 pm

I'd say you did a great deal more than summarize! Great job Ornette. I'll have to dig around and see if there's anything else I want to add.
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We're all adrift on the stormy seas of Evangelion, desperately trying to gather what flotsam can be snatched from the gale into a somewhat seaworthy interpretation so that we can at last reach the shores of reason and respite. - ObsessiveMathsFreak
Jimbo has posted enough to be considered greater than or equal to everyone, and or synonymous with the concept of 'everyone'. - Muggy
I've seen so many changeful years, / to Earth I am a stranger grown: / I wander in the ways of men, / alike unknowing and unknown: / Unheard, unpitied, unrelieved, / I bear alone my load of care; / For silent, low, on beds of dust, / Lie all that would my sorrows share. - Robert Burns' Lament for James

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Postby 0x2eleven » Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:58 am

I think the whole thing is a combined image of Yui and Unit-01.

My interpretation:
Image

It looks even better when you cut a bit off the top.
Image

I think the trees are Yui's hair because they are brownish.
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