Is RahXephon a copy of Evangelion?

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Talon [ANF]
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Postby Talon [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:57 pm

Don't bring back this filth Image_

Originally posted on: 08.01.2006, 08:12 PM

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Postby Krueger [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:57 pm

Hexon.Arq wrote:There was only one instance of this argument ever being brought up that I can still appreciate.

http://www.therossman.com/rrr/anime/rahxephon.html

Heeeeyyy... I like that review. Image

Originally posted on: 08.01.2006, 08:16 PM

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Postby Quiddity [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:57 pm

Evangelion was the first to use a lot of the themes now common with the mech genre,so many could say that any to use those themes..could be a "rip-off" of Evangelion.

Please name the themes that Eva invented in the genre.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 12:32 AM

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Postby shin_gyokakuran [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:57 pm

er Image this thread again? Image I think the word "copy" is a bit harsh. Evangelion was the "inspiration" for rahxephon. Image

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 12:42 AM

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Postby RyoTD [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:57 pm

Colossus wrote:Evangelion was the first to use a lot of the themes now common with the mech genre,so many could say that any to use those themes..could be a "rip-off" of Evangelion.

Not this crap again...

Colossus, did you even read the thread? If not, do so. If you did, then do it again.

And watch Ideon.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 06:37 AM

Tidusauron12 [ANF]
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Postby Tidusauron12 [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:57 pm

PronsAmuro wrote:Oh, and of course, Hideaki Anno used IDeon as it's main inspiration, but we don't see a site about THAT now do we?

Well, you guys are subbing it now... so... maybe some day... Image

Image

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 09:55 AM

Van [ANF]
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Postby Van [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:57 pm

And then we have a site about Ideon's influence and than we have a site about the influence for that and this never ending circle of stupidity keeps going.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 10:07 AM

Olin of Xephon [ANF]
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Postby Olin of Xephon [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

Bottom line. Neither or them are original, yet both of them are original. Let's leave it at that.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 04:47 PM

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Postby senseinobaka [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

Olin of Xephon wrote:Bottom line. Neither or them are original, yet both of them are original. Let's leave it at that.

better yet

BOTH of them are original.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 07:30 PM

Soluzar [ANF]
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Postby Soluzar [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

senseinobaka wrote:better yet

BOTH of them are largely original.

... but not entirely.

Even better still. Image

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 07:41 PM

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Postby Brill [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

But at what point does it cross the line-that is the question. Is it a dennotative or connotative rip-off? Dennotative, no. Connotative, yes. Some people will have a high burden or proof, some will only take one coincidence to delcare it a rip-off. This is the reason why this thread is so damn long. Image Eva was the first to come out with a mecha show with angtsy disfuntional pilots, shadowpuppeters, questions on the essence of humanity, and cryptic messages before commerical brakes all on one platter for you to swallow. That formula belongs to Evangelion. Anyone who follows that formula RahXephon, Gasaraki, Dual!, Gilgamesh, Blue Gender is going to be called a rip-off whether it has it's own interesting spins or not?

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 07:47 PM

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Postby MagicianCamille [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

Original does not = good.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 07:48 PM

Soluzar [ANF]
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Postby Soluzar [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

Brill wrote:Eva was the first to come out with a mecha show with angtsy disfuntional pilots, shadowpuppeters, questions on the essence of humanity, and cryptic messages before commerical brakes all on one platter for you to swallow. That formula belongs to Evangelion.

Ideon can (more or less) check every one of those boxes, and while admittedly Evangelion gave rather more exposure to some of those themes than Ideon did, it was not the first. No matter how often it is said that Evangelion was the first to do those things, it will remain untrue. Eva was just the first popular anime to do these things.

* "More or less": Admittedly the "angst" quotient is higher among the personel of the Solo Ship than it is among the pilots of the Ideon.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 07:57 PM

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Postby Quiddity [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

Eva was the first to come out with a mecha show with angtsy disfuntional pilots, shadowpuppeters, questions on the essence of humanity, and cryptic messages before commerical brakes all on one platter for you to swallow. That formula belongs to Evangelion.

And that formula was already a Tomino mainstay. It was not invented by Eva, don't you get it? Tomino was doing angsty disfunctional pilots, shadowy forces behind the scenes pulling the strings, cryptic messages, and questions on the essence of humanity a good 10-15 years before Eva was even thought up!

Now as Soluzar already mentioned slightly, Eva did make these themes a lot more popular than they were before because it was so successful. I won't deny that if Eva never came out we wouldn't have had as many successful shows from this genre. The problem is that you can't say Eva conceptually came up with or invented these things, because they were all around before it. And hence you can't call shows of the same genre that came out after Eva ripoffs of it, because the material in Eva was not invented by Eva, and hence can't be ripped off.

Both Eva and RahXephon are unoriginal shows. That said, calling them unoriginal is not an insult (unlike calling things a ripoff, which is). Unoriginality can't be unexpected, even in highly acclaimed shows like Eva. The fact that they're unoriginal infact helps them, because they contain things we've seen before, things we've already watched in other shows and know we like. Read more here: http://www.evamonkey.com/writings_shea03.php

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 08:49 PM

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Postby PronsAmuro [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

TWO threads where Ideon is mentioned in excess?! This is the best day in AN history

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 08:54 PM

Tidusauron12 [ANF]
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Postby Tidusauron12 [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

^Oh that's funny.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 09:02 PM

Brill [ANF]
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Postby Brill [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

Quiddity wrote:And that formula was already a Tomino mainstay. It was not invented by Eva, don't you get it? Tomino was doing angsty disfunctional pilots, shadowy forces behind the scenes pulling the strings, cryptic messages, and questions on the essence of humanity a good 10-15 years before Eva was even thought up!

Now as Soluzar already mentioned slightly, Eva did make these themes a lot more popular than they were before because it was so successful. I won't deny that if Eva never came out we wouldn't have had as many successful shows from this genre. The problem is that you can't say Eva conceptually came up with or invented these things, because they were all around before it. And hence you can't call shows of the same genre that came out after Eva ripoffs of it, because the material in Eva was not invented by Eva, and hence can't be ripped off.

Both Eva and RahXephon are unoriginal shows. That said, calling them unoriginal is not an insult (unlike calling things a ripoff, which is). Unoriginality can't be unexpected, even in highly acclaimed shows like Eva. The fact that they're unoriginal infact helps them, because they contain things we've seen before, things we've already watched in other shows and know we like. Read more here: http://www.evamonkey.com/writings_shea03.php

Well is any idea really original? Hasn't every aspect been covered in a Shakespearean play some 400 years ago. There are shows about good vs. evil, men fighting evil empires single-handedly, stuck-up girls, and neurotic androids-and yet there is only 1 Star Wars out there (plus a sequel). Maybe Ideon and Tomino (don't know what it is) have the similar themes and plot devices as Eva I haven't seen either-but let's face it-it didn't resonate with the public. A for effort, D for effect. Maybe they were before they're time, but timing is crucial in a way. After 1995 the number of anime shows that followed in Eva's footsteps is blaringly apparent. It changed story-telling in the industry by quite a bit-not that is was great story-telling, but it was a trend-setter.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 09:50 PM

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Postby Levon [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:58 pm

Tomino is an anime creator, not an animeImage His Mobile Suit Gundam is his biggest influence, changed the face of giant robot anime, his Aura Battler Dunbine influenced Escaflowne, his Yuusha Raideen influenced RahXephon & of course his Ideon influenced Evangelion.


Brill wrote:A for effort, D for effect.

It clearly had an effect on Anno.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 10:06 PM

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Postby Quiddity [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:59 pm

One of the most famous anime directors of all time, Tomino didn't resonate with the public? Learn your anime history my friend. Tomino's more well known than Anno is. Tomino created the real robot genre. Tomino's Mobile Suit Gundam spawned a franchise that has produced 10 complete TV series (450+ episodes), 4 OVAs and over 10 movies. Tomino's creations completely dwarf that of Anno's. You have absolutely no credibility and no leg to stand on in this argument if you don't even know who Tomino is.

And Ideon's no slouch in Japan, Animag had it ranked as the #10 best anime of all time. Just because its virtually unknown in the US doesn't make it completely ignored garbage in Japan.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 10:15 PM

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Postby Levon [ANF] » Sat Oct 20, 2007 4:59 pm

Indeed, Tomino has more fans than Anno I bet. Ever since the 70's, hell Anno is a fan! Anno's top two favorite anime are Space Battleship Yamato & the Mobile Suit Gundam(can't remember what the others were, Ideon might have been #3 though). Back in 1988 when Gundam: Char's Counterattack movie came out he made a dojinshi of the movie with interviews and I quote Anno "Char's Counterattack is great!". I have a Tomino signed Char's Counterattacked movie postImage My favorite movie.

In another interview Anno said that his biggest influence for Evangelion was Tomino's Ideon.



Tomino is huge, his recent Zeta Gundam movie trilogy that came out in Japan did amazing at the box office. Around 2 billion yen in box office last I heard, maybe more. The Zeta movie trilogy will air in theaters first in Chicago sometime this year I think or maybe next year, Tomino will be there. Wish I could go.

Originally posted on: 08.02.2006, 10:28 PM


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